00:09 *** Joins: ADragonDreaming (IceChat9@Pony-tpdjag.livnmi.sbcglobal.net)
00:10 <ADragonDreaming> fwaor.
00:16 * DashedRainbows licks Ali anyway
00:23 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Everything Wrong With Slice of Life in 8 Minutes or Less [ http://tinyurl.com/y3gjnnvu ]
01:08 *** Joins: cabbage (cabbage@Pony-0gbng9.dynamic.sonic.net)
01:22 * DashedRainbows ponies a little
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01:38 *** Joins: HyperDash (HyperDash@Pony-obvko9.wa.comcast.net)
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02:03 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Calpain: Nightly Discussion #1787 [ http://tinyurl.com/y4a296a8 ]
02:24 *** Quits: HyperDash (HyperDash@Pony-obvko9.wa.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
02:27 *** Joins: HyperDash (HyperDash@Pony-obvko9.wa.comcast.net)
02:49 * DashedRainbows licks everyhorse
02:55 * Ali is a pony so isn't licked
02:56 *** Quits: PinkieShy (coolm@Pony-ck81je.67-212-45-net.sccoast.net) (Connection closed)
03:00 <DashedRainbows> a pony is a small horse but ok
03:00 <Ali> Yes a pony is a horse but not all horses are ponies
03:01 <DashedRainbows> indeed
03:01 * DashedRainbows licks Ali too
03:02 * Ali squeaks
03:03 * DashedRainbows chews on her squeaky toy back
03:03 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Makenshi: FoE Project Horizons Music: Osoch - An Eclipsed Land (feat. Pablo Mono & Chris Wöhrer) [Metal] [ http://tinyurl.com/yyvxg57l ]
03:17 *** Quits: Cyan_Spark (Cyan_Spark@sparks.only.last.so.long) (Quit: Also on Matrix)
03:17 * DashedRainbows gallops off to return later
03:23 <Schism> Hmm. When looking at City of Heroes... the game fell between the earlier games (Everquest) and the later (WoW). It introduced a lot, and it was perhaps an incredible point between the two, one which merged the pair.
03:33 * Ali lays on Schism
03:34 <Schism> Ali: https://i.imgur.com/CQSR2Mb.png - my character. '3'
03:35 <Ali> Still find it funny that game is still going even after that CnD
03:35 <Schism> There... wasn't actually a C&D. It was just someone trolling.
03:36 <Schism> That turned into what might be politely termed 'a fluffball'.
03:48 *** Joins: PinkieShy (coolm@Pony-ck81je.67-212-45-net.sccoast.net)
03:50 * PinkieShy hands Schism and Ali a plate of deep fried pork chops, fries and ketchup
03:50 <Schism> PinkieShy: You should check that character of mine. o3o She demandes a place in your head too.
04:04 * DashedRainbows returns and wags her tail beside PinkieShy
04:08 * PinkieShy offers DashedRainbows a plate
04:09 * DashedRainbows whimpers at the empty plate
04:09 <PinkieShy> Its not empty xD
04:10 <PinkieShy> its a plate of fried pork chops, fries and ketchup :3
04:10 * DashedRainbows noms then and begs for more
04:17 * DashedRainbows begs at Schism too
04:17 *** Quits: Fn (Eogan@Pony-ontbot.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
04:17 <DashedRainbows> Also, seems the medicine helped
04:17 <DashedRainbows> Kidney function is up
04:18 *** Quits: SilentVigil (rod@Pony-do1tdj.tn.charter.com) (Connection closed)
04:18 *** Joins: SilentVigil (rod@Pony-do1tdj.tn.charter.com)
04:18 <DashedRainbows> Just two more days
04:26 *** Joins: rod_ (rod@Pony-do1tdj.tn.charter.com)
04:26 *** Quits: SilentVigil (rod@Pony-do1tdj.tn.charter.com) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
04:28 *** rod_ is now known as SilentVigil
04:46 * Ali brushies the DashedRainbows
04:47 * DashedRainbows wags her tail
04:56 * DashedRainbows licks the boss mare Ali before curling up to sleep
04:56 * Ali squeaks again and tucks DashedRainbows to bed
05:11 *** Quits: Pony|41296 (Pony41296@Pony-i454b4.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client)
05:11 *** Joins: Pony|41296 (Pony41296@Pony-i454b4.cable.virginm.net)
05:11 *** Quits: Pony|41296 (Pony41296@Pony-i454b4.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client)
05:15 *** Quits: PinkieShy (coolm@Pony-ck81je.67-212-45-net.sccoast.net) (Quit: Leaving)
05:21 * DashedRainbows whimpers. Can't sleep
05:46 *** Joins: Reia_Hope (Reia_Hope@TheCowPony)
05:47 <Finwe> o3o
05:48 <Finwe> Good morning, my perissodactyls of minute stature.
05:48 * DashedRainbows chews on Finwe's hooves
05:48 <Finwe> Mlles Ali and DashedRainbows, Messrs Cepheid and Schism.
05:48 * Finwe doffs his hat.
05:48 * Ali leans into Finwe
05:49 * DashedRainbows wags her tail to the music
05:52 * DashedRainbows also sniffs Finwe and offers fancy hay
05:52 * Finwe hits the hay. o3o
05:53 <DashedRainbows> Hay is for noms not hitting
05:57 * DashedRainbows noms on some hay
05:57 <Finwe> !hug
05:57 <DerpyBot> Hugtiem? :3
05:57 <Finwe> :3
05:57 * DerpyBot wraps her front hooves around Finwe in a tight embrace
05:58 <Ali> !seen straight
05:58 <DerpyBot> Ali: The last time I saw....will you cut that out already?!
05:58 * Finwe puts on his muffin costume.
05:58 <Ali> :3
05:58 *** Finwe is now known as DinkyBot_
05:58 <DinkyBot_> !moo
05:58 * DerpyBot chews on some hay and moos at DinkyBot_
05:58 * DerpyBot pours her muffin a glass of milk
05:58 <DinkyBot_> :3
05:58 <DinkyBot_> !sunshine
05:58 <DerpyBot> Sunshine, sunshine, ladybugs awake!
05:58 <DerpyBot> Clop your hooves...
05:58 * DerpyBot clops her hooves
05:58 <DerpyBot> ...and do a little shake!
05:58 * DerpyBot wiggles at her muffin
05:59 <DinkyBot_> *wigglewiggle*
05:59 <DinkyBot_> !plot
05:59 <DerpyBot> *wigglewiggle*
05:59 *** DinkyBot_ is now known as Finwe
05:59 * Ali boops Finwe for being silly
05:59 * Finwe takes off the muffin costume.
06:00 <Ali> !flip
06:00 * DerpyBot flips a muffin
06:00 * DerpyBot catches the muffin with her hoof, upside down
06:00 <Finwe> Hmm, it seems to be raining.
06:01 <Finwe> And the time in IRC is one hour ahead of what my laptop and telephone claim.
06:01 <Ali> Did you guys do daylight savings?
06:02 <Finwe> Probably because the IRC client runs on a sever that is located in my native time zone while I'm not.
06:02 <Finwe> Ali: Yes, although it's called "summer time".
06:02 <Finwe> We're going to abolish it 2020 or 2021, though.
06:03 <Ali> At least someone has the smarts to get rid of that stupid time change
06:17 *** Quits: HyperDash (HyperDash@Pony-obvko9.wa.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
06:33 * DashedRainbows rolls around
06:33 *** Quits: cabbage (cabbage@Pony-0gbng9.dynamic.sonic.net) (Connection closed)
06:34 *** Joins: Golden (uid250033@Pony-360sli.charlton.irccloud.com)
06:36 *** Joins: danwellby (danwellby@The.lone.griffon)
06:38 *** Joins: Surreal_Nightmares (Surreal@Cutest.Floofy.Changeling.Batpone)
06:42 *** Surreal_Nightmares is now known as Filly_Nightmares
06:42 * Filly_Nightmares squishies under DashedRainbows!
06:42 * Filly_Nightmares mowls at DashedRainbows and purrrrr
06:43 * DashedRainbows licks the Filly_Nightmares and wags her tail
06:45 *** Joins: ConfusionRift (ConfusionRi@Pony-nf551c.res.spectrum.com)
06:45 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o ConfusionRift
06:46 * DashedRainbows chews on ConfusionRift's hooves and wags harder
06:46 * ConfusionRift pets DashedRainbows. :P
06:46 <ConfusionRift> And hello everypony.
06:48 * DashedRainbows offers her toy
06:56 * Ali leans into ConfusionRift
06:56 * ConfusionRift patpats Ali. :P
06:56 * DashedRainbows licks ConfusionRift and pants
06:57 * ConfusionRift plays around with DashedRainbows .
06:57 <DashedRainbows> I should sleep. Good night horses
06:58 * DashedRainbows trots off
06:59 <ConfusionRift> G'Night, have a good one.
06:59 <Ali> You know the later it gets into a Factorio world the more confused with it I get.
06:59 <Finwe> Lt Cdr ConfusionRift.
06:59 <Finwe> o7
07:00 <Finwe> Miss Filly_Nightmares!
07:00 <ConfusionRift> RAdm. Finwe. (salutes)
07:00 * Finwe doffs his hat.
07:11 * Filly_Nightmares nomfs Finwe tummy!
07:13 * Ali gives Filly_Nightmares mango
07:16 * ConfusionRift was reminded how much he liked the Snatcher in A Hat in Time.
07:20 * Filly_Nightmares nomfs mango and then uses Ali as a bed!
07:20 *** Joins: Changeling_Nightmares (Surreal@Cutest.Floofy.Changeling.Batpone)
07:24 *** Quits: Filly_Nightmares (Surreal@Cutest.Floofy.Changeling.Batpone) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
07:24 * Finwe ruffles a Changeling_Nightmares.
07:24 <Finwe> Time for flight home soon. o3o
07:25 *** Quits: danwellby (danwellby@The.lone.griffon) (Connection closed)
07:25 <Finwe> Or, rather, a short trip to Arlanda Airport first.
07:53 *** Changeling_Nightmares is now known as Filly_Nightmares
07:53 * Filly_Nightmares purrs and rolls herself into Finwe tummy
07:59 *** Quits: Ali (Ali@Pony-mm9pf8.4nua.5fca.1702.2600.IP) (Quit: Leaving)
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08:20 *** Quits: JonTheVGNerd (VGNerd@Pony-ifa.2r2.42.24.IP) (Quit: Leaving)
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09:31 <RazorSharpFang> Hey heys. :3
09:32 *** Quits: Quill-Swirl (Nyah@Pony-jaks4r.res.rr.com) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
09:34 *** Quits: Golden (uid250033@Pony-360sli.charlton.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
09:43 <ConfusionRift> Halloooo.
09:44 <ConfusionRift> Yay super delayed response!
10:20 * DashedRainbows stretches and trots back in
10:24 <ConfusionRift> And I have to crash for work. Laters.
10:24 *** Quits: ConfusionRift (ConfusionRi@Pony-nf551c.res.spectrum.com) (Quit: Recharging the batteries. Laters! *shutdown*)
10:25 <RazorSharpFang> Atomic bomb requires production science for some reason.
10:50 * Schism wakes up, /throws/ up, and takes his daily insulin. Then drinks some milk to replenish fluids. "That was pleasant."
10:51 *** Quits: Filly_Nightmares (Surreal@Cutest.Floofy.Changeling.Batpone) (Connection closed)
10:52 <RazorSharpFang> Insulin? Are you diabetic?
10:55 <Schism> Yeah, type-1.
10:56 <ArchPegasusMichael> Morning
11:01 <Schism> Snrk. Damnit, She-Ra writers. Adora/Catra is the best OTP and you lot just keep dancing around it, laughing it up!
11:03 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Calpain: Morning Discussion #1559 [ http://tinyurl.com/y2y943s2 ]
11:04 *** Joins: Fn (Eogan@Pony-ume6m7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
11:20 <Schism> Hmmmmmmmm. Hey RSF, there are some Megagames groups over on your continent.
11:21 <RazorSharpFang> I haven't heard of them
11:21 <Schism> They're huge, hundreds-of-players roleplaying games with a strong political bent.
11:22 <Schism> Which is to say, realpolitik -- this last one was like a giant game of Diplomacy.
11:22 <RazorSharpFang> huh
11:23 <Schism> This link doesn't work for me at the moment - something with the server resolution - but here. https://wsmegagamesociety.com/megagames/bnw/
11:24 <Schism> Wait, that was from '16. The most recent one from this gent was "As the Fire Dies. (https://www.eventbrite.com.au/e/as-the-fire-dies-a-megagame-tickets-54516712956)
11:24 <Schism> "As the Fire Dies", rather.
11:26 <Schism> Here's a Let's Play thread from it. https://brokenforum.com/index.php?threads/lets-play-a-megagame-brave-new-world.10048/#post-1859924
11:28 <Cepheid> Morning.
11:32 <RazorSharpFang> Morning Cepheid
11:33 *** Joins: Cyan_Spark (Cyan_Spark@sparks.only.last.so.long)
11:33 <RazorSharpFang> Feeling better? (Migrane et al)
11:35 <Cepheid> Yeah.
11:43 <Cepheid> That said, ask me again in 3 hours. Headaches, migraines, they rarely last through the evening, if at all.
11:43 <Schism> Speaking of... *two Advil, plus a dimenhydrinate tablet*
11:44 <Cepheid> Basic progression is: 1) Wake up, I feel fine. 2) Three hours in, I start to develop a headache. 3) Six to 10 hours later, I tend to start recovering.
11:49 <Cepheid> Huh.
11:49 <Cepheid> Apparently durian fruit can cause you to fail a breathalyser test.
11:51 <Cepheid> And Hot Cross buns, apparently.
12:02 <Schism> Huh. That, I did not know.
12:02 <Schism> Also, Cepheid: https://xkcd.com/2144/
12:02 <Cepheid> Saw it, yeah.
12:03 <Schism> Too many chairs have I had.
12:03 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Hasbro's Official "How to Draw Pinkie Pie" [ http://tinyurl.com/y29nzvo6 ]
12:14 <Cepheid> You know, the Etrian Odyssey/Labyrinth of the World Tree series had a bigger impact than I think the gaming community is aware of.
12:14 <Cepheid> Up until that series, there wasn't much awareness or visibility of dungeon crawlers,
12:15 <Cepheid> Mostly all you ever heard of was the rare Wizardry game and maybe a D&D-themed game.
12:15 <Cepheid> Then Etrian Odyssey/Labyrinth of the World Tree came out. And now, you see a lot more of those kinds of games.
12:15 <RazorSharpFang> Base in factorio is really low on copper somehow.
12:17 <Schism> Hm. We have extra cheese.
12:17 <Schism> Should get some tortilla chips and make nachos.
12:17 <Cepheid> RazorSharpFang, probably because of immense amounts of construction of copper-requiring items.
12:17 <Cepheid> My advice?
12:17 <RazorSharpFang> More mines? :3
12:17 <Cepheid> Go down to the south-west corner, blueprint my massive facility, replicate it elsewhere, and send trains off to it. More mines too, yes.
12:20 <Cepheid> That massive facility of mine can handle 8000 ore a minute
12:20 <Cepheid> And is designed to unload trains in like, 5 seconds flat.
12:21 <Cepheid> On the dispatching side, it can hold up to about 230,000 plates.
12:21 <RazorSharpFang> That is a lot of plates, yes.
12:21 <Cepheid> If anything, I should redesign the rail sections.
12:21 <Cepheid> It's designed for 4-wagon trains.
12:22 <RazorSharpFang> 4-wagon is good though.
12:22 <Cepheid> This is true, yeah.
12:22 <Cepheid> It's basically designed for high-throughput.
12:23 <Cepheid> There is one part that's a bit odd, but that's mostly because it was designed that way.
12:23 <Cepheid> Basically, just before the plates reach the boxes at the dispatching side, I split a single belt into two belts, each with one lane utilized only
12:23 <Cepheid> That is, I go from 6 to 24.
12:24 <Cepheid> I use a 6-6 balancer to feed two 3-6 balancers, which gets me up to 12 belts. Then I use lane splitters to further split up the 12 belts to 24 belts.
12:25 <Cepheid> I do it this way because later on, if I want, I can expand the smelters on the side to have 12 output lanes.
12:25 <Schism> Cepheid: I'd like to be able to sell Moero Chronicle Hyper to you, but a few minutes watching and I gave up. XSEED clearly had no part in the translation.
12:26 <Cepheid> Schism: Oh?
12:26 <Schism> It's quite literal.
12:28 <Cepheid> Yeah, the original was apparently done by XSEED.
12:29 <Schism> Idea Factory pairs with them frequently, yeah. But the hyper... I dunno. Maybe I'm imagining things.
12:30 <Cepheid> Localization as of late has been hit-and-miss with a lot of games.
12:30 <Cepheid> Namco really messed up with Tales of Vesperia Definitive Edition, for example.
12:31 <Cepheid> In that case, what happened was the vocals.
12:31 <Cepheid> They retranslated the game, yeah.
12:31 <Schism> I'm reminded of the voice change to Krile in FFXIV.
12:31 <Cepheid> But they only redid the vocals for the lines that changed.
12:31 <Schism> And ah, yup.
12:32 <Cepheid> And they used a different VA for some characters.
12:32 <Schism> Patchwork, then.
12:32 <Cepheid> So you got inconsistent voiceovers.
12:32 *** Quits: ADragonDreaming (IceChat9@Pony-tpdjag.livnmi.sbcglobal.net) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
12:32 <Cepheid> Then there was the whole debacle with Ys 8.
12:32 <Schism> Thaaaat I remember.
12:33 * Schism facedesks repeatedly. "Why do I remember?!"
12:33 <Cepheid> This is partly why I'm learning Japanese.
12:34 <Cepheid> More and more, games are supporting both dual-audio and dual-text. Or multi-audio, multi-text as in some case.s
12:34 <Schism> Ted Woolsey, come out of retirement! (Woolsey says: Hahaha no.)
12:34 <Cepheid> I can play the entirety of some of my Switch games in complete Japanese.
12:34 <Cepheid> Games I own that I'm aware of that allow that right now are...
12:35 <Cepheid> Blaster Master Zero 1 & 2, Dragon Marked For Death, Octopath Traveler, Labyrinth of Refrain: Coven of Dusk, and a few others.
12:36 <Cepheid> In order to play most of them in their native Japanese, you need to switch the OS language for the Switch itself.
12:37 <RazorSharpFang> That is a bit weird yeah
12:38 <Cepheid> Some games support switching internally, I think BMZ1&2 do that. Most Inticreates games, actually, I think.
12:39 <Cepheid> It was a new feature added to the Switch OS about a year ago, actually. Shortly before Octopath was released.
12:40 <Cepheid> My guess is, the OS can now boot separate executable files based on language. That, or recent advances in common engines have enabled support of relatively easy UI changes based on language.
12:41 <Cepheid> The usual excuse for not supporting the original Japanese language has often been that there were architectural changes in the code.
12:41 <Cepheid> Or, data limitations.
12:41 <RazorSharpFang> I am struggling to think about how on earth I'd support CJK languages.
12:42 <Cepheid> Like I said.
12:43 <Cepheid> You parse your script when it's complete, then from that, generate a list of every glyph used in the script.
12:43 <Cepheid> Then you take that list, and generate one or more texture atlases with all the glyphs used by the script, along with information to translate UTF codepoints to locations into the atlases.
12:44 <Cepheid> It becomes more complicated if you plan to allow for modding.
12:44 <RazorSharpFang> I'm not using textures in my game though.
12:44 <Cepheid> What's the engine again?
12:44 <RazorSharpFang> Gamemaker.
12:45 <Cepheid> Version?
12:45 <RazorSharpFang> GMS 2.2.2.413
12:46 <Cepheid> Game Maker Studio 2, okay then. Let's see.
12:46 <RazorSharpFang> My current system for supporting all Indo-European languages utilises a single SWF file.
12:47 <Cepheid> You're not using GMS' font editor?
12:48 <RazorSharpFang> No, I'm running my own stuff.
12:49 <Cepheid> You're gonna have to explain the system a bit then. How are you getting individual glyphs into the game?
12:49 <Schism> SWF...
12:50 <RazorSharpFang> I have an SWF file that I compiled that contains shape data for the glyphs as fills.
12:51 <Cepheid> Any particular reason why?
12:52 <RazorSharpFang> Lets me scale text immensely, arbitrarily without pixelation.
12:52 <Cepheid> Ah, so you're using SWF for outlines that can later be filled in.
12:53 <Schism> Mm, there are worse choices for vector fonts, admittedly.
12:53 <RazorSharpFang> Each frame of the SWF file corresponds to a single glyph. Frame 34 is `!` etc. (Frame starts at 1, there is no frame `0` )
12:54 <Cepheid> That is a roundabout method for using vector fonts, I have to admit.
12:54 <Cepheid> I cannot say how well it'd actually perform in the long run.
12:55 <RazorSharpFang> Yeah, I want to do some benchmarking, myself.
12:56 <Cepheid> I dunno how GM handles SVG and vector graphics, but unless it like, caches the results to a texture atlas or something, it's not going to perform well at all.
12:57 <RazorSharpFang> What sort of benchmark would you recommend to test that theory?
12:57 <Schism> Well, I mean, for a monologue or a particularly full textbox, aren't you looking at somewhere like 300 instances of the SWF file at once?
12:58 <RazorSharpFang> The file is loaded once, each frame of the file is a glyph.
13:01 <Cepheid> Full screen of text, point-size 12, DPI 96 would be the worst "common" case. It's a bit more complicated to benchmark text rendering.
13:02 <RazorSharpFang> So 1920x1080 display area, filled with 12pt (what does pt mean?) text of Lorem Ipsum?
13:03 <Cepheid> Point size, denoted by pt, is 1/72th of an inch. And yeah, that would work for a worst-case benchmark at 1920x1080. Becomes problematic to benchmark when resolutions change, though.
13:04 <RazorSharpFang> Okay, I don't know how to do pt then. What MaxTextHeight would match 12pt on a 1920x1080 display?
13:04 <RazorSharpFang> Oh, my display isn't that big either.
13:04 <Cepheid> This is where the complication arises, with the pt size translation.
13:05 <RazorSharpFang> How about 12px high?
13:05 <Cepheid> That works too, it's a good way to also specify things, yes.
13:05 <Cepheid> But it too is subject to the same problems.
13:05 <RazorSharpFang> Well, what if someone's display is 1366x768 :3
13:06 <Cepheid> Do you want the font size to stay consistent across resolutions?
13:06 <Cepheid> That is, do you mind if it shrinks and grows as the resolution decreases or increases? Or do you want it to stay a consistent size?
13:06 <RazorSharpFang> It should scale linearly with the display size.
13:08 <Cepheid> Assume 1920x1080 is the default resolution, and that the font height will be 12 pixels. Pixel height at other resolutions thus changes to: 12.0 * (ScreenHeight / 1080)
13:09 <RazorSharpFang> What if their display ratio changes too? :3
13:09 <Cepheid> Then you're screwed.
13:10 <Cepheid> IT becomes even more complicated.
13:13 <Cepheid> It depends primarily on stuff like concepts you plan to use for rendering text, and so on. Like, textbox across the bottom of the screen? Or floating textboxes on the screen near the characters speaking, etc.
13:14 <RazorSharpFang> There'd be a dialogue box in a fixed position, but you'd have floating text too, like to annotate events, sfx, status effects etc.
13:15 <Cepheid> The fixed textbox is going to be the biggest issue.
13:16 <Cepheid> If you design around the idea of rendering lines long enough to fit on a 16:9 or 16:10 resolution, it'll end up going off the edge for other aspect ratios like 4:3 or 5:4.
13:18 <RazorSharpFang> Nah nah. I'd just do the following: "The bottom 30% is where the dialogue box is"
13:19 <RazorSharpFang> The dialogue box would place text to conform the size of the box.
13:19 <Cepheid> So linebreaking and such?
13:20 <RazorSharpFang> Word breaking if necessary. (Word longer than allowable)
13:20 <RazorSharpFang> i.e.: If a word cannot be displayed without running off the edge, even if it's the first)
13:24 <Cepheid> Should be fine, depending on how it's done, but there are some issues that come to mind, that I can't quite express properly.
13:26 <Cepheid> Let's say you've got this one big chunk of dialogue text associated with a character, and you need to show it all at once. It's three lines long, taking into account line-breaking being performed at the far end of the dialogue box, at 1920x1080 resolution.
13:26 <Cepheid> On a 4:3 screen, this chunk of text may be five or six lines instead.
13:27 <Cepheid> Thus, it covers up more of the scene.
13:27 <RazorSharpFang> As I said, 30% is the amount of screen real estate permitted. No more, no less.
13:27 <Cepheid> Fair enough.
13:28 <RazorSharpFang> Line-breaking is done arbitrarily. A "message" doesn't contain any newline characters.
13:28 <Cepheid> Honestly, there's one approach I've seen that works kind of nice.
13:29 <Cepheid> CrossCode does a nice form of dialogue rendering. Last I recall, they limited each advancement of the dialogue to like, one or two sentences, max.
13:29 <Cepheid> By keeping the advancement of dialogue limited, and sentence lengths limited, you limit the potential that there'll be issues with different aspect ratios.
13:30 <RazorSharpFang> Messages can be arbitrarily long. :3
13:30 <Cepheid> Good luck with that.
13:30 <RazorSharpFang> They get broken into lines as needed to conform to the space allotted, like text in a website.
13:31 <Cepheid> The only real problem I can see with that is it can affect certain storyline situations.
13:31 <RazorSharpFang> Storyline situations? How so?
13:32 <Cepheid> It's hard to explain, give me a moment, as I also need to do a bit of math.
13:33 <RazorSharpFang> Good news, we're up to 92% evolution.
13:40 <Schism> "Wait. You're a spirit of chaos. You can manifest ... intermediate products. Acids, bases. You can basically manifest atoms and molecules which would be all kinds of useful in the preparation of elemental metals." "Yeah, but I don't want to do it as a job.
13:43 <Cepheid> https://pastebin.com/JY7mKX3k Very wordy. Sorry.
13:43 <Cepheid> I might be thinking too much into stuff, though. I tend to do that.
13:44 * Cepheid has his laptop plugged in. Wonders why he has brightness at minimum.
13:44 <RazorSharpFang> Cepheid, the length of a "Message" will be crafted as such that it can be designed to have a long intro message, a short big-reveal message, and then a long message after.
13:46 <Cepheid> Still have to be careful with it.
13:46 <Cepheid> But like I said.
13:46 <Cepheid> There are ways around the issue.
13:46 <Cepheid> Like advancing the dialogue sentence-by-sentence instead.
13:46 <Cepheid> Each period at the end represents a full-stop anyways, so the idea works.
13:47 <RazorSharpFang> Super long sentences, with a big reveal at the end of the longest sentence ever.
13:47 <Cepheid> Run-on sentences are a thing, yes.
13:47 <Cepheid> And I don't know how to account for those, other than re-writing them so they aren't run-ons.
13:47 <Cepheid> But given that typical human speech tends to be run-on-sentence-like, it's kind of an issue.
13:48 <RazorSharpFang> I'd just advance "line by line" with "line" being defined as how much text will fit on the screen.
13:48 <Cepheid> Like I said, I'm probably reading into this far too much.
13:48 <Cepheid> There are simpler ways to just handle it, plus the whole "Screw these concerns" type deals.
13:51 <Cepheid> !link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VfSIZexGCxI This is... an interesting style of music. I can't identify it.
13:51 <DerpyBot> Twilight told me this video is about [東方自作アレンジ] 514 [原曲:ハルトマンの妖怪少女]
13:52 <Schism> Electroswing.
13:52 <Cepheid> Ah.
13:52 <Schism> I've linked a few songs of that genre before, like Parov Stelar's stuff.
13:52 <Schism> And Caravan Palace.
13:54 <Schism> !link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbsBEb1ZxWA
13:54 <DerpyBot> Twilight told me this video is about Caravan Palace - Lone Digger (album version)
13:55 <RazorSharpFang> Caravan palace makes... interesting music videos.
13:56 <Schism> This one in particular doesn't have the animation, but the animation -is- definitely worth seeing.
13:56 <Cepheid> Where did this style originate from anyways?
13:57 * Cepheid grabs a BPM calculator to determine something.
13:57 <Schism> I ... /want/ to say that Parov Stelar was one of the originators, but memory deceives me frequently.
13:58 <Cepheid> There's an interesting trait to music that I like, which has literally nothing to do with it's style or sound, a lot of the time.
13:59 <Cepheid> Namely, the BPM. Most of the music I like has a certain perceived BPM to it.
14:00 <Cepheid> Minimum seems to be around 115-120.
14:01 <Schism> TakeSomeCrime did a particularly good dance to 'Catgroove' some years ago. It turned out to be a sensation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twqM56f_cVo
14:02 <Cepheid> It's weird, but the higher the BPM, for me, often the better.
14:02 <Cepheid> I can't quite figure out why. My brain wants to assume it's because I can't predict beats at slower speeds.
14:02 <Schism> You must absolutely /loathe/ the DDR song "Bag".
14:03 <Cepheid> Truth told, I'm not quite sure I'm counting beats.
14:04 <Cepheid> It's hard for me to express because I lack musical talent, background and terminology.
14:05 <Schism> BPM is a poor measure of a song anyway. ... and I did not intend that pun, but I'm committed to sending it you now.
14:05 <Cepheid> To best express it, let's go back to that Caravan Palace song you linked.
14:05 <Schism> to you.
14:06 <Cepheid> Songs are split into segments.
14:06 <Cepheid> Distinct, specific-speed segments.
14:06 <Schism> The opening, the bridge, the reprise, the finale. Yes.
14:06 <Cepheid> No, no.
14:06 <Schism> Well, even then.
14:07 <Cepheid> Let's say, you got a portion of a song that repeats twice or thrice. Each repetition can be considered a "segment" to me.
14:07 <Cepheid> And I mean repeating in sequence.
14:07 <Cepheid> Not like, one entire length of song being repeated later.
14:07 <Cepheid> If you tap your fingers to it, it often tends to have an explicit number of "taps" associated with it.
14:07 <Cepheid> Often, 4, 8 or 16.
14:08 <Cepheid> Some songs deviate from these numbers, but..
14:08 <Schism> 4/4 time is pretty standard, yes.
14:08 <Cepheid> These are the most frequent I've noticed.
14:08 <RazorSharpFang> I get 4 FPS on my benchmark. :3
14:08 <Cepheid> Not surprised.
14:08 <Cepheid> OpenGL, D3D, Vulkan and the like are not designed to rasterize vector graphics on-request.
14:09 <Schism> Okay, here's how it works. When writing a song, you get a 'measure'. This is most commonly 4/4 time, but you get 3/4 time with waltzes and the like. This means that the beat tends to go something like tap tap TAP repeat.
14:09 <Cepheid> Is that what it's called? Measure?
14:09 <Schism> A measure of music is like a stanza in a poem, yeah.
14:10 <RazorSharpFang> Real music is played in 15/16
14:10 <Schism> RSF: Damn your eyes, I was going to get that eventually.
14:10 <Cepheid> What do the two numbers represent? How many "taps" are associated, and how many times those taps are repeated?
14:10 <RazorSharpFang> https://i.imgur.com/YZX18yD.jpg - this is the benchmark I did, WAY more text than I ever expect to put on the screen. Ridiculous amounts of text really.
14:11 <Cepheid> Yeah, that's a bit much.
14:11 <Schism> Cepheid: Well, it's all centered around 4/4 time, which is to say, there are four 'quarter' notes in a measure. That's your basis.
14:11 <Cepheid> Does the measure affect the speed of the song? Or is that some other aspect of musical composition?
14:11 <Schism> No, that's tempo.
14:11 <Cepheid> Then it's tempo I'm likely linking to my interest in songs.
14:12 <Schism> Well, yes and no.
14:12 <Schism> The measure affects how the song /feels/. A waltz sounds rather different from common time.
14:13 <Schism> "This sentence is like poetry, its every word defined." Read that out loud, and you'll probably stress every other syllable.
14:13 <Cepheid> I'd need to perform an experiment or three to figure out what my brain is latching onto.
14:14 <Finwe> o3o
14:14 <Cepheid> For example, listen to low and high tempo songs of the same measures.
14:14 <Finwe> Good afternoon, everypony.
14:14 <Finwe> Messrs Cepheid, RazorSharpFang and Schism.
14:14 <Schism> Not a bad idea. Also, hello, rAdm. Finwe.
14:14 * Finwe doffs his hat.
14:15 * Schism doffs his nachos with cheese.
14:15 <Cepheid> But the issue is in finding songs with specific measures and low/high tempos.
14:15 <Finwe> A woollen cap, actually. While I was in Sweden, the temperature had gone down to almost 0°C.
14:16 <Schism> Monstercat is a pretty good source there, then.
14:16 <Schism> Their songs tend to be listed by BPM and genre.
14:16 <RazorSharpFang> I get a 20% speedup if I don't enable anti-aliasing.
14:17 <Cepheid> Heh.
14:17 <RazorSharpFang> I get a 10% speedup on top of that if I select the lowest SWF quality. :3
14:18 <Cepheid> I actually wonder how well I'd manage with making music.
14:20 <Cepheid> Pretty sure tapping to a measure is a pretty common skill, but I can also adjust tempo in my head. If I've memorized a song well enough, the sound of it, I can play it back in my head at any tempo desired.
14:21 <Cepheid> So long as I have something to measure how fast I'm playing it back in my head by, like say, tapping my fingers at a set speed.
14:23 * DashedRainbows licks Finwe
14:24 <RazorSharpFang> Cepheid, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4DcFR0Jd--k - this is a good track, but you'll be able to hear it's 5-step timing, which is odd and neat.
14:24 <Cepheid> Heh.
14:26 <Cepheid> !link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fcV6uIUu5_U
14:26 <DerpyBot> I need to ask Twilight about that one.
14:26 <DerpyBot> Twilight told me this video is about Miss Divine (feat. Cereza)【東方\/Touhou Electroswing】「Norowareta Night」
14:27 <Cepheid> Overall, I do have to say something about music, as a whole, though.
14:27 <Cepheid> I notice a *LOT* of duplicate patterns in songs.
14:28 <Cepheid> To a point where when I hear one pattern, I can predict how it's going to sound at each tap, even if I've never heard the song before.
14:29 <RazorSharpFang> That's the entire point of music, it's interwoven patterns that you don't have to memorise to play along with.
14:30 <Cepheid> This is true, but it can lead to a lot of similarity between different songs, even from different composers.
14:30 <Schism> Your school should probably have a course on basic music theory. That might suit you well.
14:30 <Schism> Also, this should be familiar to you. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pidokakU4I
14:32 <Cepheid> Heh.
14:33 <Cepheid> Sheesh.
14:33 <Schism> It gets better. X3
14:34 <Cepheid> There's gotta be something about those specific, four chords that has a psychological impact.
14:35 <Cepheid> That does raise a question for me though.
14:36 <Cepheid> Those four chords, in the video, he demonstrates them each once, but then during the music, he's playing each chord in a sequence of X times, over a period of Y times, where Y is divisible by X.
14:36 <Schism> There's a wikipedia article about it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I%E2%80%93V%E2%80%93vi%E2%80%93IV_progression
14:36 <Schism> And that's the tempo, yeah.
14:37 <Cepheid> How does that relate to measure?
14:37 <Schism> The chord progression tends to follow, where each measure has one chord.
14:38 <Cepheid> So, the above would be, 4/4?
14:38 <Schism> In this case, yes, but that's not precise. It could work just as well in 3/4 time.
14:39 <Cepheid> So 3 repetitions of each chord, 4 chords?
14:39 <Cepheid> Measure is confusing to me. o3o
14:39 <Schism> No, each measure has the chord -- so you'd get unstressed-unstressed-STRESSED, repeated four times, but with different underlying chords.
14:40 <Schism> So for the first, I -- then for the second, V, and so on.
14:40 <Schism> That's not precise, because 3/4 time can go Stressed/unstressed/unstressed, or put the stress in the middle, but those are exceedingly rare.
14:42 <Cepheid> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bar_(music)#/media/File:Hypermeter.png ... This does a better example of explaining measure to me
14:43 <Schism> Here's an example of 3/4 time vs. 4/4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHAit6d2N9c - the waltz -- vs. this 4/4 case. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNefNLOHVYk
14:43 <Schism> Also, yeah. That's a better example.
14:44 *** Joins: Jouva_ (jouva@Pony-7hugks.fios.verizon.net)
14:46 *** Quits: Jouva (jouva@Pony-7hugks.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
14:47 <RazorSharpFang> `if(initialised == false) { /* initialise stuff */ }`
14:47 <RazorSharpFang> Good documentation.
14:50 <Schism> I'd honestly prefer too much documentation to not enough. Someone your organization hires in the future will probably ask 'what does this function do' anyway.
14:51 <Schism> I must wonder, though, what method flips the 'initialised' bit.
14:54 <Cepheid> Musical notation is weird.
14:54 <Schism> Yes.
14:55 <Schism> I should also point out that a standard piano octave starts with C, and goes CDEFGAB.
14:56 <Schism> And that musical staves differ depending on if you're bass or treble. I'm quite convinced that musical notation is the work of programmers.
14:58 <OctaveSymphony> blep?
14:58 <Cepheid> I'm actually getting confused by metre and bars.
14:59 <Cepheid> The numbers don't seem to correspond to sane traits.
14:59 <Schism> They're... honestly more like guidelines.
15:00 <Cepheid> Heh.
15:00 <Cepheid> Guh, my mother's awake, and for some reason, her presence is... getting to me, because she keeps looking around or at me, and I keep having to take my headphones off.
15:00 <Cepheid> Or ask if something's up, etc.
15:01 <Schism> Ah. She is /looming./
15:01 <Cepheid> This is a trait I absolutely hate among people. I'm a visual person, I work off of visual cues. People who can't hold still and look around or express visually that something has their attention bug me to no end.
15:01 <Cepheid> Especially if I'm the only other person in the room with them.
15:02 <Cepheid> And then there is, of course, people just talking idly to themselves.
15:03 <Cepheid> While I'm wearing headphones
15:03 <Cepheid> It's like... really?
15:03 <Cepheid> You're talking to yourself in my presence, when I'm the only other person around?
15:03 <Cepheid> It's distracting.
15:03 <RazorSharpFang> Some people like to talk to themselves, others have difficulty keeping their thoughts from becoming words.
15:03 <Schism> Um. I tend to ... express myself with gestures and the like. While we get along fine in text, you'll probably hate me RL-wise.
15:04 <RazorSharpFang> The latter tend to get in trouble, or offend people.
15:04 <Schism> That or immediately bond. I'm weird that way.
15:06 <Cepheid> I don't mind it in general.
15:06 <Cepheid> It's when I'm trying to work or focus on something.
15:07 <Cepheid> I don't like having minute, irrelevant distractions every few tens of seconds or minutes.
15:07 <Cepheid> Normally I take the appropriate approach, rather than get upset with the person and ask them to move, I leave.
15:07 <Cepheid> But it's annoying, because oftentimes leaving means going to somewhere I don't want to be.
15:10 <Cepheid> I'm an asshole.
15:12 <Schism> Here's your badge of membership and free drink.
15:14 <Schism> To paraphase a writer, "Wisdom is knowing you were an idiot in the past, foresight is knowing you'll be an idiot in the future, and common sense is knowing you're an idiot today."
15:17 *** Joins: LibrarianofHope (Librarianof@Pony-ieu.86c.207.187.IP)
15:17 <RazorSharpFang> I think 64px is a good text height for my dialogue box.
15:17 <Cepheid> Ironically, this problem only occurs with singular people in the room.
15:17 <Cepheid> If multiple people are in the room, it's easy for me to ignore the behaviour.
15:17 <Cepheid> It's only when there is only one other person in the room, or when the person is somehow associated with me, that it becomes a problem.
15:18 <Cepheid> And only, ONLY when I'm trying to focus on something.
15:18 <LibrarianofHope> sup
15:20 * DashedRainbows chews on LibrarianofHope and barks
15:20 * LibrarianofHope polishes cepheid until shiny
15:21 <Schism> "Wait, was that it?" "Training is to prepare for the worst possible situation. That way, when you get confronted with a mook like this, you don't screw up." "Yeah, but... oh, he's reviving himself. Okay, then." "Yup. Forward march."
15:22 <LibrarianofHope> a game on the side of the mook thta fights a reviving main charcter could be fun
15:22 <LibrarianofHope> very meta
15:23 <Cepheid> Man, I hate how operating systems represent paths differently.
15:23 <Schism> Yeah, but you create a different filesystem and congrats! You've got a new standard to add to the pile.
15:25 <Cepheid> The underlying file system doesn't really matter in regards to paths.
15:25 <LibrarianofHope> i guess its due to the origin of the tech in the first place no?
15:25 <Cepheid> Especially since usually, the filesystem conforms to the operating system's path format.
15:25 <LibrarianofHope> so much guesswork when it was being made that no standard could be found
15:25 <Schism> In this case, Windows machines still cling to DOS' particular means of pointing towards files.
15:26 <Schism> While Linux points to them in a very, very different way.
15:26 <Cepheid> Fortunately, it's possible to use a generic format, and translate it to Windows/DOS formats.
15:26 <Cepheid> But further issues stem from the way that Linux doesn't necessarily label arbitrary partitions or drives automatically.
15:26 <Cepheid> Or set them up as roots.
15:27 <Cepheid> So for example, on a Windows system, multiple partitions will be listed as C:\, D:\, E:\, etc.
15:27 <Schism> In that way, Windows does actually win. Not in a good way, of course.
15:27 <Schism> But a sensible fashion...
15:27 <Cepheid> On a Linux system, partitions can be mounted to arbitrary locations.
15:27 <Cepheid> So for example, partition 1, which would be C:\ under Windows, might be / under Linux.
15:28 <Cepheid> Meanwhile, partition 2, which will be D:\ under Windows, might be mounted/bound to /home
15:28 <Schism> I like that flexibility, but it does complicate matters.
15:28 <Cepheid> I honestly prefer the Linux approach, myself.
15:28 <Cepheid> That said, I think Windows handles that formatting.
15:29 <LibrarianofHope> as usual, i get half of the whole
15:29 <Cepheid> That is, you can bind a partition to a folder.
15:29 <Cepheid> LibrarianofHope, it's nothing major in this case.
15:30 <Cepheid> A path is basically just a string that represents a location. For example, "C:\Windows" is a path to the Windows folder. "C:\Windows\explorer.exe" is a path to a file in the Windows folder, etc.
15:30 <Cepheid> Under linux, the format's a bit different.
15:30 <Schism> Well, it equates to the same thing, you just get the OS pointing to a folder anyway. It's a matter of taste.
15:30 <Cepheid> "/home/cepheid" would represent a directory on the system called "cepheid"
15:30 <Schism> Yes, there are a lot of complications.
15:30 <Cepheid> "/home/cepheid/filename" would represent a file within that directory.
15:31 <Cepheid> Under Linux, "/" would approximately be equivalent to "C:\" on Windows.
15:31 <Cepheid> Otherwise known as "the root folder" or just "the root"
15:31 <RazorSharpFang> What if filename was the name of a folder in `/home/cepheid/` ?
15:31 <Cepheid> Depends on the filesystem.
15:32 <Cepheid> Most filesystems for Linux allow any character except control characters(0 through 31 inclusive) in filenames, directory names, and so on.
15:32 <Cepheid> So you could legitimately do "/home/cepheid/" being a file.
15:32 <Schism> Filesystems that basically serve as card catalogues... darnit, now I have to whiteboard one for my character.
15:32 <Cepheid> More or less.
15:33 <Cepheid> Filesystems just tell you where to find data, in the most simple of terms.
15:33 <Schism> Yup.
15:33 <Schism> Metadata, as it's termed.
15:34 <Cepheid> Directories/Folders are abstract. They actually exist as data on the drive in most filesystems, but that isn't actually even required.
15:34 <Schism> The question then becomes, "Is there a better way?" And that's something I kind of want to ask Donald Knuth.
15:34 <Cepheid> You could just have a hard drive set up such that the only thing you can specify about each file is it's filename. Not where it's located in some sort of tree of folders or directories.
15:35 <Cepheid> In such a system, you'd probably group stuff together by simply putting the associated grouping data into the filename. Instead of storing a file in X subdirectory of Y subdirectory of Z, the root, you'd just give the file the name "/Z/Y/X/nameOfFile"
15:35 <Schism> That strikes me as machine code - raw pointers and all.
15:36 <Schism> And in so doing, Cepheid, you'd create a filesystem!
15:36 <Cepheid> Long story short, LibrarianofHope, you don't need to worry about any of this.
15:36 <Schism> I dunno, it strikes me as how libraries should be organized too.
15:36 <Cepheid> Not unless you're like, designing a server, or a machine with a very specific purpose.
15:37 <Cepheid> The layout is important, yeah.
15:37 <Cepheid> But the underlying details of how all that is handled is irrelevant to the average user.
15:37 * LibrarianofHope worries not and goes pet dashedrainbows
15:37 <Schism> You've been in a library, Cepheid. Do you know how it's organized?
15:37 <Cepheid> To some degree.
15:37 <LibrarianofHope> a public library?
15:38 <Cepheid> Yes. There's one nearby my place.
15:38 <LibrarianofHope> the dewey decimal or library of congress as far a i know
15:38 <Schism> The underlying details of how it's organized might be irrelevant to you in some ways, but you still rely on it.
15:38 <Cepheid> I don't really care what system they use for organizing, so long as it's in some sort of order based on name of book, or author.
15:38 <Cepheid> The bigger issue is less that.
15:38 <Cepheid> It's more "Where in the library do I find section A to D?"
15:39 <Schism> Mm. Face vs. Backside.
15:39 <Cepheid> It's fine that you tell me that this book I'm looking for is in the Agriculture section.
15:39 <Cepheid> But where the hell is the agriculture section?
15:39 <Cepheid> Layouts of libraries have no consistent organization in regards to that.
15:39 <Cepheid> Book stores, too.
15:39 *** Joins: danwellby (danwellby@The.lone.griffon)
15:40 <Cepheid> There's a Chapters I visit on a somewhat-regular basis downtown, as it's one of the larger ones in the city.
15:40 <Schism> True. Even the used book store downtown has little in the way of layout.
15:40 <Cepheid> But they regularly re-organize the store.
15:40 <Cepheid> And they don't provide maps.
15:40 <Cepheid> So I have no idea where the computer section is every time I visit it.
15:40 <Schism> Oh gods. I used to work for Barnes and Noble (a US chain of the same bent). Those reorganizations... yeah.
15:41 <Cepheid> ...
15:41 <Cepheid> See, this is what I mean about people doing irrelevant stuff around me and getting my attention for no reason.
15:41 <Schism> ... yeah, let's move away.
15:41 <Cepheid> I'm sitting here. "Mrmrmrmrrrmrmrm" I hear, because my mother's talking in the kitchen and I'm in the living room with headphones on.
15:41 <Cepheid> I remove my headphones and ask what she said.
15:42 <LibrarianofHope> as a librarian of sorta book organization is tricky
15:42 <Cepheid> "Oh, I just ran some cleaner through the washing machine."
15:42 <Cepheid> ... Okay?
15:42 <Cepheid> Was there a reason you had to tell me this?
15:42 <LibrarianofHope> in a bookstore you need to get the best product at eye level
15:42 <Cepheid> What possible use could I have for such irrelevant information? Why did you have to talk to me? Why did you have to tell me?
15:43 <LibrarianofHope> who told you?
15:43 <Cepheid> You ran cleaner through the washing machine. Huzzah, who ******* cares?
15:43 <Schism> M..aybe to let you know not to do laundry for the next bit?
15:43 <Cepheid> It doesn't impact me. It doesn't affect me.
15:43 <Cepheid> Nah.
15:43 <Cepheid> She didn't say anything about not doing laundry.
15:43 <Cepheid> It is literally useless information.
15:43 <LibrarianofHope> random conversation
15:43 <Cepheid> Completely ****** useless.
15:43 <Schism> You might appreciate a bit of Douglas Adams.
15:43 <Cepheid> Don't bother me with such irrelevant ****.
15:44 <Cepheid> If you're gonna distract me from my work, provide me with information I can use.
15:44 <Cepheid> If you don't want me using the washing machine because you're putting cleaner through it, say so.
15:44 <Schism> Ford Prefect figured that people tell themselves such irrelevant things to comfort themselves. He briefly toyed with the idea that if Earthlings stopped talking, their brains started working, but dismissed that as entirely too cynical.
15:44 <Cepheid> Don't tell me you just put cleaner through it, and don't say why this is relevant to me.
15:45 * Cepheid sighs.
15:45 <Schism> Such is life.
15:45 <Cepheid> I'm agitated today. I probably consumed too much coffee.
15:45 <Cepheid> Or made one that's too strong.
15:45 <Schism> Right. I need coffee... and have none. Perhaps tomorrow.
15:45 <Cepheid> I wish my school bus pass didn't expire.
15:45 <Cepheid> I'd have gone in to the school today.
15:46 <Schism> It's something like $90 for a monthly pass here. I'd pick one up, but I so rarely go out...
15:46 <Cepheid> It'd be quieter than Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup's Tomb.
15:46 <Schism> ... if you're playing DCSS, we should absolutely run the same seed sometime.
15:46 <Cepheid> I'm not. But I'm familiar with the game.
15:47 <Cepheid> I've read through an LP of it.
15:47 <Cepheid> Plus I have an informational/structural interest in roguelike games, classical roguelikes, not the games that are labeled as "roguelike" to mean "permanent death"
15:48 <Schism> I know the type you mean. DF is a roguelike, in that eventually, your fortress _will_ die or become boring.
15:48 <Schism> Survival isn't as much fun as getting a herd of elephants to eliminate, say, Glazedcoast.
15:49 * Cepheid sighs. "Why do I have to be so susceptible to small details distracting me?"
15:49 <Cepheid> Mother's working in the kitchen, and I hear murmuring over the music. Or perhaps my cat reacts to some noise there, and so on.
15:49 * Finwe hats on Cepheid.
15:49 <Cepheid> I'm analytical of my surroundings.
15:49 <Cepheid> Can't be bothered to pay attention to buildings going up kilometers away.
15:50 <Cepheid> But I track everything going on around me subconsciously.
15:50 <Cepheid> My eyes are focused on the laptop screen, on the text I'm writing.
15:50 <Cepheid> But I pay attention to stuff around the laptop screen, where my eyes are focused. If I see someone's head turn, if I see my cat look up and around, it catches my attention.
15:51 <Cepheid> If I hear something, but can't make out what it was, I make assumption of speech because you never know.
15:51 <Cepheid> Especially with the way my parents like to constantly call me from locations completely detrimental to me understanding what they said.
15:51 <Cepheid> My mother is particularly fond of that last one.
15:51 <Cepheid> She'll ask me questions from her chair in the living room, while I'm upstairs in my bedroom, with the door closed.
15:51 <Schism> You're not the only one. Give me the tiniest distraction, and my train of thought derails.
15:52 <Cepheid> And she *KNOWS* I have hearing problems.
15:52 <Cepheid> This, this is why I refuse to date.
15:52 <Cepheid> THis is why I don't want relationships.
15:52 <Cepheid> Having someone walking around my house, trying to talk to me, or get my attention for irrelevant stuff.
15:52 <Cepheid> I don't want it.
15:53 <Schism> "Hey, Andrew, what do you think of [unintelligible]?
15:53 <Cepheid> I don't honestly know how people live like this.
15:53 <RazorSharpFang> Nah, it'd be more like "Hey, [garbled], you know?"
15:53 <Cepheid> But that's just because I'm not an atypical person.
15:53 <Cepheid> Er, typical*
15:54 <Cepheid> I am... different from the norm, both mentally(Mental health) and physically(hearing impaired)
15:54 <Schism> Honestly, the only way my brother and I get along here is by politely ignoring one another unless it's time to buy groceries, where we say, "What'dya want?" "Eh, X, Y, Z, what'dya?" "A, B, C." "Cool." "Cool."
15:54 <LibrarianofHope> i dont want a relationship at thos moment on a similar logic, i need to advance my work
15:55 <Cepheid> Hence similar. I'm fine with not advancing my work, etc.
15:55 <Cepheid> But I don't like being distracted from what I'm doing.
15:55 <Cepheid> And it's easy to do.
15:55 <Schism> He's got his room, I've got mine, it works.
15:55 <LibrarianofHope> yeah, ill get a girlfiend eventually, no hurry
15:55 <Cepheid> Because the reasons I get distracted easily are behaviours that I use to work in this world.
15:55 <Schism> An ability to pinpoint an issue from a mile away!
15:56 <Cepheid> I'm hearing impaired, so I make use of more cues for figuring out what's going on than most people.
15:56 <Schism> This is kinda why I keep getting tapped as a GM. Not so much 'attention to detail' as 'oh gods, there's a tick on your ear'.
15:57 <Cepheid> I'm sure I'd be fine had I still been hearing impaired to the degree I was when I was a child.
15:57 <Cepheid> But unfortunately, that's not the case. And what's moulded into my brain is stuck in place.
15:57 <Schism> You're pretty strong all in all.
15:57 <Cepheid> Asking me to turn off these extra cue monitoring behaviours would be akin to me asking someone to change their personality.
15:57 <Cepheid> Can't be done at the drop of a bin.
15:57 <Cepheid> Er, pin*
15:58 <Cepheid> This is why I choose to move away rather than ask people to stop doing <X>, <Y> or <Z>
15:59 <Cepheid> What it is they are doing is likely a part of their personality, or some other hardwired trait.
15:59 <Cepheid> Just as awareness and reaction to cues is hardwired in myself.
15:59 <Cepheid> Doesn't stop me from getting agitated, though.
16:00 <Cepheid> I feel better now, by the way.
16:00 <Schism> Youuu... can't stop monitoring, no. You can be asked to stop /reacting/, but even that's pretty darned rude.
16:01 <Cepheid> I can be asked to stop reacting, but again, that's akin to asking a person to change their personality.
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16:01 <Cepheid> Sometimes the reactions are hardwired.
16:01 <Schism> Yeah.
16:01 * Cepheid checks out Lone Digger's animation, after hearing that Caravan Palace's animations are weird.
16:02 <Schism> Be prepared for a lot of... er... fur.
16:02 <Cepheid> Heh. Interesting style.
16:02 <Cepheid> It stands out, at least.
16:03 <Schism> It's very good, no questions.
16:12 <Cepheid> I wonder weird things. Like, for example, I wonder what the output would be if I commissioned an artist to draw what they thought I looked like, based on what I wrote. Like, provide a log of the last few hours, and ask them to draw what they think I look like, based on everything I've talked about, etc.
16:12 <Cepheid> With freedom to use whatever styles, traits, etc.
16:12 <Schism> That's an interesting idea. What do we look like, based on our chats...
16:13 <Schism> Through the eyes of another person, even.
16:13 <Cepheid> Mmhmm.
16:14 <Cepheid> I mean, I'm not sure about the rest of you, but I tend to have a mental visual representation of each of you, nothing definitive, but a general idea of what you look like, based on the personality and manner of writing that I see.
16:14 <Cepheid> I suspect I do this because it makes it easier for me to talk to you all.
16:14 <Schism> You probably also have each of us as a specific voice in your head.
16:15 <Cepheid> Mmhmm.
16:15 <Cepheid> The problem with perceiving myself based on my own writings and such though is that I am biased.
16:15 <Cepheid> Humans, when they examine themselves, tend to be biased either towards positive or negative self-images.
16:15 <Cepheid> There's no neutral in between, usually.
16:16 <Schism> The weird thing is that, even having heard your voice -- I tend to think of you as 'neutral'. That's a biased reflection, of course.
16:16 <Schism> It's the damnedest thing, but you come across that way.
16:18 <Cepheid> To myself, I often see myself as two separate entities.
16:18 <Schism> Only two?
16:18 <Cepheid> Often one driven by another.
16:18 <Cepheid> Mmm.
16:18 <Schism> I am legion, I contain multitudes.
16:18 <Cepheid> More like I'm a sentient person with my own mind and soul, but at the same time, I am a vessel for something else.
16:19 <Schism> Cepheid, I'm a writer. Every time I write a character, they instance themselves in my brain.
16:19 <Cepheid> Often I see myself as one of two "configurations." First configuration is that of my physical body, with a bright, blazing, variably-sized orb floating behind myself, regularly growing or shrinking in size.
16:19 <Schism> The really 'real' ones start arguing with me.
16:20 <Cepheid> The second configuration is that of, again, my physical body, but the orb is gone. Instead, I have a glowing, thin disc radiating from my midriff, the radius of which is usually extreme.
16:20 <Schism> And mm. That's.. hm. Contextually, in Freudian psychology, that might be the struggle between the id and the ego.
16:21 <Cepheid> The reason I commonly feel like I am two entities is that there are times when I feel like I am not myself, or I am not in control of myself.
16:21 <Cepheid> And therefore, something else must be controlling the physical body.
16:21 <Schism> The other 'self'.
16:21 <Cepheid> You think I want to lash out at people? I hate myself when I lash out at others, hurt others, etc.
16:21 <Cepheid> And yet, inexplicably, I still do it.
16:21 <Schism> So, dissociation. Hm.
16:21 <Cepheid> And in the end, I usually become completely and utterly depressed about what I did, and apologize constantly.
16:22 <Cepheid> I know fight-or-flight often results in the body doing things that can't be controlled, but still.
16:22 <Schism> Those in the chat who feel the same, by the by, speak up.
16:23 <Schism> No, that sounds... very familiar. I still have no idea why people think that I'm somehow a responsible adult, for example.
16:23 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Makenshi: Pony Concept Album: SDreamExplorerS - Ephemeral II: Parallels [Prog Rock/Prog Metal] [ http://tinyurl.com/y3u7m8bw ]
16:24 <Schism> That lashing out, the destructive response... is something I do too.
16:24 <Cepheid> And then there's the weird disparity in my likes and dislikes.
16:24 <Cepheid> I abhor violence.
16:24 <Cepheid> And yet, I want to pick fights.
16:24 <Schism> Same. To be able to punch something...
16:26 <Schism> We get the urge to commit violence, but ultimately, our morals preclude us from doing so.
16:26 <Cepheid> Hence the consideration of martial arts, for me.
16:26 <Cepheid> Besides the whole learning self-control thing..
16:26 <Cepheid> Sparring would alleviate that desire to pick fights.
16:26 <Schism> And it's healthy.
16:27 <Cepheid> Compared to say, boxing or UFC-style stuff.
16:27 <Schism> Also, look at why we tend towards picking fights. We're still monkeys, despite everything.
16:27 <Cepheid> Mmhmm.
16:28 <Cepheid> I'm aware of the psychological reasons behind a lot of behaviours in people. Still doesn't make it any easier to cope with.
16:28 <Cepheid> Awareness does not equate to control.
16:28 <Schism> If it did, puberty would be a lot easier.
16:29 <Cepheid> Humans pick fights simply because, at the most basic level, fighting is the simplest way to fulfill our animalistic need to be top dog.
16:29 <Cepheid> You look at pack animals, animals that have groupings with leadership, etc.
16:29 <Cepheid> How do they pick who's the leader?
16:29 <Cepheid> Usually by fighting.
16:30 <Cepheid> Someone doesn't like what the leader's doing? Challenge 'em. If you win, you can do things your way. IF someone doesn't like it, they'll challenge you. They win, you do things their way.
16:31 <Cepheid> I refuse to believe for a minute that humans are above animal instinct and behaviour.
16:31 <Schism> Of course, that line of thinking has its limits. Someone who's /smarter/, for example. Physical strength can go so far, but intelligence... well, there's a reason humans evolved to have huge heads. Gotta have the brains to deal with one another.
16:32 <Cepheid> We are still driven by it. It just appears in different forms, because laws, rules, regulations determine how we fulfill those basic instincts and behaviours.
16:32 <Schism> Yup. Somewhere down the line, we learned to cooperate, and compete via cooperation.
16:32 <Cepheid> Might means right isn't just about physical strength.
16:33 <Cepheid> It's about something that is measurably better than something else.
16:33 <Schism> It still remains a matter of personal and social viability. We've not yet learned to break that. Not sure we will.
16:34 <Cepheid> I don't know what the term is for periods of time beyond millennia, but the entire period of human existence, in it's varying forms, is immense compared to the time that humanity has been "civilized."
16:35 <Schism> I like the term 'Epoch'.
16:35 <Cepheid> A few millennia is likely not enough time for us to evolve out the animalistic traits that drive us.
16:35 <Cepheid> Assuming that can even be done.
16:36 <Schism> Transhumanists think that we can weed out those biological desires, but I'm leery about that. They're a part of what make us... well, /us./
16:37 <Schism> Without that biological desire to sow our seeds for the future, a lot of things would disappear.
16:37 <Cepheid> I'll be honest, I'm of the belief that removing those traits in any direct manner would be detrimental.
16:37 <Cepheid> Rather than beneficial
16:37 <Cepheid> Let me put it this way, because of the complexity of the human brain..
16:38 <Cepheid> I would not try out cures for my mental illnesses.
16:38 <Schism> This is part of why I think that the gerentocracy we currently have is problematic. The old folks might be 'wise' (and what is wisdom?), but they have no desire to look to the future.
16:38 <Cepheid> They are troublesome, I admit, but they aren't worth the potential risks.
16:38 <Cepheid> Now, if any one of these mental illnesses were going to kill me, then yeah, I'd take a chance with a cure that messes with my brain.
16:39 <Schism> In your case, the goal might be to look to the future - to help folks prevent whatever you have.
16:39 <Cepheid> But I can live with my mental health. It's possible that a cure will be found for my illnesses, and trial runs will show they work.
16:39 <Cepheid> But what are the long-term effects?
16:39 <Cepheid> And I'm not talking months.
16:39 <Cepheid> I'm talking decades.
16:39 <Schism> That's the goal, anyway. And there is that normative concern...
16:40 <Cepheid> Decades down the road, we could find out that a cure for my bipolar actually causes neuron-level degeneration.
16:40 <Schism> Well, take antibiotics.
16:40 <Cepheid> Because the cure somehow interacted with the reproduction of neurons, or influenced the chemicals needed by them.
16:40 <Cepheid> On top of that, toying with neurons is risky business.
16:41 <Cepheid> Medications work because they only affect the chemicals neurons use.
16:41 <Schism> Turns out that antibiotics create strains of bacteria which are resistant.
16:41 <Cepheid> Yep.
16:41 <Cepheid> When it comes to the brain, I'm more concerned about the effects of damaging a neuron directly, rather than say, a button or receiver.
16:41 <Schism> So by solving the problem now, we're creating worse ones down the line.
16:41 <Cepheid> Or a synapse.
16:41 <Cepheid> Neurons aren't just singly-linked lists.
16:42 <Schism> And when you talk about synapse blockers, yeah.
16:42 <Cepheid> They're these cells that have one receiver, and then branch off to a number of other neurons.
16:42 <Cepheid> You remove one neuron, what does it do to the person? The usual signal paths that take that neuron no longer work.
16:42 <Schism> Computer science has a lot of relevant points, here. You patch one problem, it creates three more.
16:43 <Cepheid> Is the brain resilient enough to remap the connection through another neuron? If so, what does going through that other neuron do?
16:43 <Cepheid> Brains are too complex for us to be manipulating neurons directly, or the genetics involved in their replication.
16:43 <Schism> Usually, it is, but then... is that person still the same?
16:43 <Cepheid> There's that, too, since we still don't fully understand how consciousness works.
16:44 <Cepheid> What makes me separate from you.
16:44 <Schism> We get to talk about the Chinese Box problem, as well.
16:44 <Schism> That one's fun, look it up if you enjoy nightmares.
16:45 <Cepheid> Ah, that problem.
16:45 <Schism> Yup. That's consciousness.
16:46 <Cepheid> It's a complicated problem.
16:46 <Cepheid> I mean, even if we managed to create a snapshot of a human's brain, and then reproduce all the connections, "neurons" and such..
16:46 <Schism> "Thank you for fueling my nightmares. What the hell are you doing with magic?" "Creating a computer." "I should probably just shoot you now, shouldn't I?" "Probably."
16:47 <Cepheid> There's no way to tell if, when simulating that, it is distinct from the person, or connected to the person, or if it even qualifies as consciousness.
16:47 <Schism> You absolutely must play CrossCode.
16:47 <Cepheid> Heh.
16:47 <Schism> SERIOUSLY. It talks about all this.
16:48 <Cepheid> My mind goes deep places, if I let it.
16:48 <Cepheid> This is what happens when I don't distract myself.
16:48 <Cepheid> This is why I'm constantly either gaming or coding.
16:48 <Schism> We generate layers. o3o
16:48 <Schism> We can come up with fantastic things, though. We are thinkers, dreamers, movers and explorers. And we know many things.
16:48 <Cepheid> I get more lost in some subjects than I do going through TV Tropes or Wikipedia.
16:49 <Schism> Still say you should read "Ignition!". It's fantastic.
16:49 <Cepheid> It's not that I don't want to think about them, it's just if I do, I spend a lot of time on it.
16:50 <Cepheid> Anyways, I'm gonna go take a shower. I feel grimy and it's reaching a breaking part.
16:50 <Cepheid> Point*
16:51 <Schism> Good reason. Enjoy!
16:56 <Schism> "Oh. my. god. You're all awesome. Reading magic blind -- feeling it -- I can finally go all-out on you!"
16:57 <DashedRainbows> This infusion is going a lot slower today :(
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17:02 * DashedRainbows sniffs Quill-Swirl
17:03 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Fanfiction (Scouted): Scootadate [ http://tinyurl.com/y439yxlb ]
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17:13 <RazorSharpFang> https://i.imgur.com/XgC9Zjd.png - the textbox is splitting text properly into lines that fit.
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17:23 <Cepheid> Yeah, it's a straightforward thing to implement.
17:24 <Cepheid> Just grab the next word, calculate it's dimensions. If the position + size > screen dimensions, shift rendering down and back to the start of the screen.
17:25 <RazorSharpFang> I'm not grabbing the next word, I do it character by character.
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17:26 <Cepheid> That works too. The approach I'm thinking of implies the existence of those "print character by character at x speed" UIs for RPGs.
17:27 <RazorSharpFang> I don't think I'd bother with printing at speed.
17:31 <Cepheid> Yeah, it's just a style thing, and many games are forgoing it.
17:31 <Cepheid> I dunno why, but today's just one of those days where I dun want to do anything other than sit here and read.
17:32 <Cepheid> My mom says I don't look good. Maybe the infection's getting to me.
17:33 <Cepheid> ...
17:33 <Cepheid> And as I say that, I suddenly go through a hot flash.
17:33 <Cepheid> My ears feel like they're burning, and now I'm suddenly sweating.
17:34 <RazorSharpFang> I'm off to sleep, good night.
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18:03 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Drawfriend Stuff (Pony Art Gallery) #2966 [ http://tinyurl.com/y6jnohox ]
18:04 <Cepheid> I think screws are coming loose inside my laptop. *AGAIN*.
18:06 <Cepheid> Oh, definitely, yeah.
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18:59 <Cepheid> Thought.
19:00 <Cepheid> A company that hedges on impulse buying, like fast food restaurants and candy producers, can influence the public in a roundabout manner. By creating a product concept so incredibly stupid, so incredulous, so outrageous, and then advertising it on social media, they abuse a trait shared by a lot of people on social media.
19:00 <Cepheid> The desire to share the original post, and express just how stupid the concept is.
19:00 <Cepheid> Which then gets re-shared by their followers.
19:00 <Cepheid> Which then gets re-shared by *THEIR* followers.
19:01 <Cepheid> Sure, the concept will be ridiculed, and no one will ever fall for it or buy it, because of how ridiculous it is.
19:01 <Cepheid> But the branding, the catch phrases, the marketing, it's all in that initial post.
19:01 <Cepheid> It seeds the mind.
19:01 <Cepheid> People will knee-jerk react, calm down, and five minutes later, they'll forget about it.
19:02 <Cepheid> Few hours later, "Hey, I could go for a <product> from <company>."
19:02 <Cepheid> It's a counter-intuitive marketing technique. You rely on the fact that people like to share stupid stuff ALL THE TIME.
19:02 <Cepheid> And complain and/or laugh at it.
19:42 <Cepheid> Huh.
19:42 <Cepheid> Bloodstained is being released next month.
20:03 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Calpain: Comic: Pie Twi / Delta Vee Main Story 3 / AHNM 1:10 / Wonder / Investigation 1 [ http://tinyurl.com/y52ofugl ]
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20:43 <Schism> Phreeeow. Just woke up...
20:45 <Cepheid> I'm getting too good at this.
20:45 <Cepheid> I just disassembled my laptop to fix up some loose screws.
20:46 <Schism> Ah, the mad scientist's concern.
20:48 <Cepheid> Hinge screws came loose again.
20:53 <Schism> At some point I'd be tempted to suggest some manner of fixative, but short-term solutions cause longer-term problems.
21:00 <Schism> Indian food tonight.
21:00 <Cepheid> I applied locktite onto the screws this time.
21:00 <Cepheid> But even then, it's probably not gonna be totally resolved.
21:00 <Cepheid> The plastic that the hinge attaches to seems to be flexing quite a bit.
21:00 <Cepheid> Compared to the other hinge.
21:00 <Schism> Cepheid: Dinner for 4 here. o3o http://www.vijaysindiancuisine.com/tk_menu.php
21:01 <Cepheid> I am not a big fan of indian food.
21:01 <Schism> But... but chicken tikka...
21:02 <Cepheid> Nope.
21:02 <Schism> Anyway, hmm. I should pull apart my own laptop.
21:03 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Makenshi: Pony Rap Album: ShobieShy - The Sho [Hip Hop] [ http://tinyurl.com/y4rwaf6j ]
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21:12 <Cepheid> If it's one of those thin laptops, I'd advise against it. Pain in the arse.
21:13 <Schism> Nah, it's an HP from long ago.
21:15 <Cepheid> Ah.
21:19 <LibrarianofHope> i wanna go rummage in the attic owo
21:19 <LibrarianofHope> im in a treasure hunty mood
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21:29 *** ChanServ sets mode: +qo Ali Ali
21:31 <Cepheid> I'm almost 100% certain my mood swings as of late are a result of this infection.
21:31 <Ali> That stinks, taking anything for the infection Cepheid?
21:32 <Cepheid> Yeah.
21:32 <Cepheid> Amoxiclav prescription, 2 weeks. Special nasal spray.
21:33 * DashedRainbows licks Ali, and offers hay
21:33 * Ali noms DashedRainbows's tail instead
21:33 * DashedRainbows barks, hhm, neighs instead
21:37 <Schism> Cepheid: This solution strikes me as very 'you'. http://narbonic.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/12/061211.jpg
21:39 <Cepheid> Heh.
21:40 * DashedRainbows chews on Ali's hooves also
21:42 <Schism> This is also a very Cepheid solution. http://narbonic.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/12/061216.jpg
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21:45 <Cepheid> Heh.
21:46 <Ali> So I haven't played Factorio in awhile, hows the craziness coming Cepheid?
21:46 <Cepheid> I haven't touched it recently, so I don't know. Razor might have touched something, as is the norm for him.
21:47 <Cepheid> But I can tell you I created a factory that can process 8000 ore a minute.
21:49 <Ali> If its survived the bugs eating it down if they got there.
21:53 <Cepheid> The entire base is walled off at this point.
21:54 <Cepheid> With turrets guarding the entire perimeter.
22:03 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Starlight X Twilight - Decoy World [ http://tinyurl.com/yy9eoejx ]
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22:07 <Ali> Cepheid, has the server been updated to .35?
22:10 <Cepheid> There was an update? Didn't notice. I'll go update it.
22:12 <Ali> Well my steam version is saying in the notes that a .35 was done
22:13 <Cepheid> There ye go.
22:13 <Ali> I'm fighting off drowsiness right now so I can't go on right now, but at least would want it updated if I did.
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23:03 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: My Little Pony Omnibus Volume 5 - Now Listed on Amazon [ http://tinyurl.com/y3z8sd83 ]
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23:47 <PinkieShy> hihi
23:48 <PinkieShy> Went grocery shopping today and learned.. Meat market is cheaper :3
23:48 <PinkieShy> Like got 2 large packs of cube steak, 5 thick cut pork chops, and 4 steaks all for just under $30
23:49 <PinkieShy> Walmart would probably have wanted like $50 for all that.. >_>
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