Log archive of EquestriaDaily for Monday, 2020-05-11

00:07 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Penny Wrights: Equestria Girls "Monday Blues" Follow Up [ http://tinyurl.com/yc2xufgl ]

00:29 <RichardMist> bye everyponies, gotta go *waves*

00:31 *** Quits: RichardMist (User@tor.sasl.RichardMist) (Quit: Leaving.)

01:09 * Ali flops onot the Schism

01:10 * Schism provides the Ali with a slice of key lime pie, with the graham crackers pressed nice and tight and a dollop of whipped cream ladled profoundly atop.

01:10 <Ali> Eh, if only Schism

01:10 <Ali> I'm without a PC monitor

01:10 <Schism> Alas.  :<

01:11 <Ali> Having to use a TV as a back up, else I wouldn't be online right now

01:11 <Schism> Well, does the TV at least work in this pinch?

01:11 <Ali> It does, its not perfect

01:11 <Schism> Rarely is.

01:11 <Ali> But monitors are next to impossible to get right now

01:11 <Ali> Went to three stores, all sold out of every model

01:11 <Ali> And the earliest Amazon can get one here is a week

01:12 <Ali> I mean I'd go stir crazy without my PC or internet access

01:13 <Schism> Agreed.  And I'm in much the same boat.  I was so happy to get out of the hospital after just a few days.

01:16 <Ali> Oh yeah that

01:16 <Ali> At least now I can still Motorsport Manager and Stardew Valley

01:16 * Ali sits a nice luke warm Joja Cola on Schism's head, fresh from a trash can~

01:16 <Schism> There is that.

01:17 * Schism casually tosses it into a pond, without drinking it.

01:17 <Ali> Three seconds later you fish it back up

01:17 <Schism> Hah.  By the way, sunflowers are a nice cash crop during their seasons, at least without a huge initial investment.

01:17 <Ali> So I gots lucky Schism

01:17 <Ali> I got a Prismatic Shard~

01:18 <Schism> Nice!  Did you figure out what to do with it?

01:18 <Ali> Sunflowers?  Those are competing against blueberres and cranberries

01:18 <Ali> And yeah I know how to get the Galaxy Sword

01:18 * Schism nodnods.

01:18 <Schism> Tho mummies take bombs.  :<

01:18 <Ali> Yes I know

01:18 <Ali> I've died to the flying dragons more than the mummies

01:19 <Ali> Just can't get down to iridium levels

01:19 <Ali> Cause the one thing I don't like about the combat in Stardew

01:19 <Ali> Is without heavy investments in other things

01:19 <Ali> Your max defense is a terrible 4

01:19 <Schism> They're all iridium levels, but unless you're willing to bring a lot of staircases, they're kinda... yeah.

01:19 <Schism> And yup.

01:19 <Ali> Like, its pointless

01:20 <Ali> When those flying jerks do like 30+ damage

01:20 <Schism> Oh, yeah, those.  .-.

01:21 <Ali> And the plus defense weapons, they're worthless in Skull Cavern cause their damage is too low

01:21 <Ali> So the only other defense upgrade

01:21 <Ali> Is by killing 60 rock crabs first

01:21 <Schism> Those aren't so terrible so long as you swing a pickaxe at them to break off the shell.

01:22 <Ali> They're not a hard mob to defeat

01:22 <Ali> Its just finding them as they spawn at a very low rate

01:23 <Ali> Like I haven't even killed 30 of them yet

01:23 <Ali> I'm just trying to get my starfruit abuse going

01:24 <Ali> Turn the greenhouse into a massive starfruit farm

01:24 <Ali> Then throw the fruit into the kegs

01:24 <Ali> Along with Artisan boost, those things sell for SO MUCH MONEY

01:24 <Schism> Well, yes.  o3o

01:25 <Ali> I'm trying to catch all the fish as well

01:25 <Ali> Sadly I still have one of the hardest fish to catch

01:25 <Ali> The Lava Eel

01:27 <Ali> Other than that

01:27 <Ali> I'm missing the Ice Pip, the other fish found on floor 20

01:27 <Ali> I few winter fish

01:27 <Ali> And all the legends

01:27 <Schism> My luck with fishing is weird.  In FFXIV, it took me about 30 cycles to catch the damned lightning fish which only shows up in stormy weather.  Someone else caught in one.  Then there was that Endoceras which everyone has a hard time with, and I caught it in one.  Similarly, Legend was easy for me, but the Woodskip...

01:28 <Ali> Woodskip?  That's an odd one to struggle with

01:28 <Schism> Yeah, I know.

01:29 <Ali> I mean I'm up to Fishing Lvl 9 in my currently playthru

01:29 <Ali> The only ones I tend to struggle with are the ones with kneejerk reactions

01:30 <Schism> Octopuses jump, bounce bounce bounce bounce, moving all around, tent-tentacle.

01:30 <Ali> Like the wiki says that its next to impossible to catch the Octopus without all the buffs

01:30 <Ali> Yet somehow I did it with Fishing Lvl 9 and a cork

01:30 <Schism> Eh, sometimes you get lucky.  Glad you did tho.  o3o

01:30 <Ali> yeah I got the lazy meter

01:30 <Ali> I now have 9 octopi in a fishing pond~

01:30 <Ali> Or is it 7?

01:31 <Ali> Sorry its 7, haven't had to toss the green tea into the pond

01:31 <Schism> Either way, that should net you some helpful materials.

01:31 <Ali> Omni Geodes

01:31 <Schism> Yus, that.

01:31 <Ali> There's a chance you can get 1-10 of them from them

01:31 <Schism> Which will get you many of the requisite materials and relics required to unlock the Sewer Key.

01:32 <Ali> Well don't forget

01:32 <Ali> You can turn 5 Omni's into the dessert trader to get artifact troves

01:32 <Ali> And I need the sewer key to catch all the fish

01:32 <Ali> Can't get a void salmon or slimejack without it.

01:33 <Ali> As well as the sewer legend

01:39 <PinkieShy> Might have to replace one of my gamecube games >_>

01:40 <PinkieShy> Like one of them has a bad scratch on it from the looks of it.

01:40 <PinkieShy> Plus the game is now $100 used... which honestly isn't that much compared to the price of most new games lol

01:41 <Ali> Which one is that?

01:41 <Ali> Probably one of the two pokemon titles

01:41 <PinkieShy> Pokemon Col..

01:41 <Ali> Yeah...

01:41 <Ali> Col is expensive along with XD

01:41 <PinkieShy> I got Pokemon XD as well.. I plan to play the heck out of that.

01:41 <Ali> The only thing that ticked me off about XD

01:41 <PinkieShy> I wanna get my Shadow pokemon back and finally 100% it

01:42 <Ali> Oh then did you get Shadow Lugia?

01:42 <PinkieShy> Yes :D

01:42 <Ali> I mean purified him

01:42 <PinkieShy> I even opened his heart back in the day.

01:42 <Ali> I was ticked

01:42 <Ali> That they didn't let it keep that color

01:42 <PinkieShy> They need to make another shadow pokemon game..

01:42 <Ali> It looked so cool in Shadow mode

01:42 <Ali> Or let that have been its shiny form

01:42 <PinkieShy> But they might not want to as the dark story that is behind the games really if you think about it..

01:43 <Ali> Yeah the shadow saga was pretty dark

01:43 <Ali> BUT

01:43 <PinkieShy> The bad guys made them shadow/closed their hearts so they would attack humans..

01:43 <Ali> That would allow the best guy ever to come back

01:43 <Ali> Cause START THE MUSIC

01:43 <PinkieShy> If i knew a petition to make pokemon release a new game on the switch would work.. I would do one

01:44 * Ali throws Mirror B at PinkieShy

01:45 <PinkieShy> Play that funky music :P

01:45 * PinkieShy offers to dance with Ali to the Mirror b song

01:45 * Ali sends out Ludicolo and Ludicolo

01:46 <Ali> And I'm talking XD's version, not Col

01:47 <PinkieShy> I wanted a shadow groudon back in the day lol

01:49 <Ali> Pft

01:49 <Ali> I still find it funny that the bonus disc for Col is expensive

01:50 <PinkieShy> I'm using Dkoldies for old games and stuff.. They seem nice :)

01:51 <PinkieShy> Talked to their CS and they are super nice and answered everything for me :D

01:51 <PinkieShy> I might just ask if they can resurface the col game i got

01:51 <PinkieShy> Since their office tour video on YT shows they have that equipment..

02:06 <PinkieShy> Speaking of Shadow pokemon.. Nintendo is still probably about shadow things..

02:06 <PinkieShy> Look at what they did to Luigi back in super paper mario.. (MR. L) He was like wearing black and everything.. Shadow Luigi more like it

02:07 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Calpain: Nightly Discussion #2157 [ http://tinyurl.com/yce8rty5 ]

02:14 <Ali> PinkieShy, I /think/ they brought shadow pokemon to Go

02:48 * Filly_Nightmares latches onto Ali

02:48 * Filly_Nightmares purr

02:48 * Ali cuddles Filly_Nightmares carefully

02:51 <PinkieShy> Well.. Just unplugged the cable box.. Next step is to just get all the cables and such ready for Tuesday.

02:51 <PinkieShy> I saw the new one on the cable provider website.. Its going to be way way smaller now.. It looks to be about 1/4 the size of the router we got from them

02:52 * Filly_Nightmares eee!

02:52 * PinkieShy attaches to Filly_Nightmares like Velcro

02:58 * Filly_Nightmares nom nom nom PinkieShy ears and uses as bed

03:03 *** Quits: OctaveSymphony (OctaveSymph@Octave.fluffy.pegasi.mare) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)

03:05 *** Joins: OctaveSymphony (OctaveSymph@Octave.fluffy.pegasi.mare)

03:17 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Calpain: Comic: Mother's Day / AoS 5:17 / The Future 15 / To Harden 3 [ http://tinyurl.com/yaxllj5k ]

03:18 <ADragonDreaming> My hovercraft is full of eels.

03:20 * Ali headtilts at ADragonDreaming

03:28 * Schism reads from a book, and asks Adra, "If I seeid yu had a ... byuutiful bod-ay, would yuu hold it against me, bouncy bouncy?"

03:29 *** Quits: Stormspark (stormspark@Pony-25m.dcd.98.172.IP) (Quit: Leaving)

03:30 *** Joins: Stormspark (stormspark@Pony-25m.dcd.98.172.IP)

03:38 *** Quits: Stormspark (stormspark@Pony-25m.dcd.98.172.IP) (Quit: Leaving)

03:51 <Schism> Also, bleh.  Second BLU challenge is tricky, clearing all those puddings in a sensible time.  They're immune to physical.

03:53 <Schism> I have no trouble in clearing all those challenges by themselves, but doing so with the bonuses, that's hard.

03:54 <Ali> Dun look at me, I dun't 14

03:55 <Schism> Ali: Nah.  Tis just a matter of loading up the enemies with tons of debuffs and then going to town.  Anyway, slep.

04:07 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Makenshi: Wonders Of Dreams Album: Nicolas Dominique - Dreamshaper [Ambient/Chillout] [ http://tinyurl.com/yav9wvxf ]

04:29 <Cepheid> <Me> There.  Ya happy now?  <Spitfire, probably> No.  Because you stopped petting me.

04:38 <Ali> Mine would be the other way around Cepheid

04:38 <Ali> You stopped petting me?  GOOD! SO LONG SUCKER

04:38 <Cepheid> Heh.

04:57 *** Quits: cabbage (cabbage@Pony-u30cht.dynamic.sonic.net) (Connection closed)

05:01 * PrincessRainbows makes upset horse noises and yawns before booping Ali's horn

05:01 <Cepheid> Election campaigns in the next year or two are going to be interesting.  I fully expect to see anti-socialist parties do a 180 to abuse the socialist leanings of the public due to COVID-19 and associated lockdowns.  Once they get elected(or re-elected), I fully expect them to do another 180 and go back to the status quo.

05:01 * Ali poofs PrincessRainbows into her hooves and cuddles her so much

05:01 <Ali> Of course cause politicians

05:02 <Cepheid> I pretty much expect them to do it because politically, this is a smart idea.  The general public can, and would dall for it.

05:02 <Ali> I say things to get elected, don't expect me to follow up on them

05:02 <Ali> The general public isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer

05:03 <Cepheid> Especially the people who have decided to abandon their favorite party because right now it encourages stupidity.

05:03 * PrincessRainbows makes silly filly noises and hugs

05:03 <Cepheid> But the moment said party becomes more appealing, they will just go back.

05:04 <Cepheid> People who leaned towards you in the past are easier to manipulate than those who leaned away from you.

05:05 *** Quits: Pony|68258 (Pony68258@Pony-i454b4.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client)

05:05 <Cepheid> This is an example of why I am not a good person.  Given a bit of time to think, alongside analyzing the current situation, I can think of malicious ways to abuse people.

05:05 * PrincessRainbows decides to curl up in Ali's hooves for sleepies

05:05 * Ali tucks PrincessRainbows to beds

05:09 <Cepheid> Politics seems like a straightforward game to me.  Examine things the opposition has done in the past.  Bring it up.  Make it sound worse than it is, because most people aren't familiar with logical fallacies.  Also, tell the public what they want to hear.  Once you're in, it doesn't matter what you said you'd do.  People no longer have control over what you do until the next election anyways.  At which point you're not going to be

05:09 * PrincessRainbows clutches her favorite plushie and pacifier too. Nini

05:12 <Finwe> Morning, everypony!

05:12 <Ali> This is why Politicians do jack do do for 95% of their time in office

05:13 <Finwe> Mlles Ali, PrincessRainbows and Filly_Nightmares; Messrs Cepheid and Schism.

05:13 * Finwe doffs his hat.

05:13 * Ali doffs over Finwe on a extremely large monitor

05:13 <Cepheid> And playing the nice person doesn't work either.  I know this from the rumors I heard about my uncle who tried to play the straight, truthful politician.  He won the mayoral race for Cornwall, but when I was down there doing work for the city, I asked people how he was doing.  Turns out there were all sorts of unverified rumors about him, including cheating on his wife, having illegitimate children and the like.

05:13 <PrincessRainbows> (snore)

05:13 <Ali> People will always make up dirt about you

05:13 <Finwe> I don't have any extremely large monitors.

05:13 <Ali> This is why the Enquirer is still publishing BS

05:14 <Ali> Finwe, I'm now on a 52" TV until I can get a new monitor

05:14 <Cepheid> And the problem is, people like gossiping.  So the dirt spreads, whether it is true or not.

05:14 * Finwe boops Ali with a regular 16:10 24 inch monitor.

05:14 <Ali> Oh I only wish Finwe

05:14 <Ali> But mine died

05:14 <Finwe> I don't have a TV either.

05:14 <Ali> You can lie to anyone, all it takes is one person to believe in your lie to get it to spread

05:15 <Ali> Like the Tide Pod Challange

05:15 <Ali> Common sense should tell you NOT to eat the stupid thing

05:15 <Cepheid> It depends on the lie though.  There is a point at which you start to question the veracity.

05:15 <Ali> but the internets tolds you you can so NOM NOM dead

05:15 <Cepheid> And that point varies between age groups.

05:17 <Cepheid> Also, it is worth noting that while yes, the tide pod challenge was being followed because people were stupid, the number of people injured by it was only a small fraction of the population, suggesting that the more incredulous the lie, the less likely people are to believe it.

05:17 <Finwe> If a display larger than the monitors is needed, this has to do: https://pro.sony/en_GB/products/lamp-projectors/vpl-fh30

05:17 <Cepheid> The only reason it gained attention as it did and started a media frenzy was because it was something for the media to focus on for views.

05:19 <Cepheid> Because of two particular human traits.  We like knowing we are better than other people, and we also like being reminded of this fact.  So the media inundates us with proof of this because we know we will watch it for enjoyment.

05:20 * PrincessRainbows borrows Finwe as an extra plushie

05:20 <Cepheid> I believe this is one of the reasons the media covers every little thing that Trump does.

05:20 * Finwe radiates sleepiness.

05:20 <Ali> And is beating Covid like a dead horse

05:20 <Colgate> Ali: speaking of display, have you tried holding a flashlight to it while it is on and seeing if you can see anything on the display? it might be a backlight

05:21 <Colgate> wanted to say that earlier, but you were offline :P

05:21 <Ali> Colgate, It doesn't stay off

05:21 <Colgate> sure, can still be a flickering backlight

05:21 <Ali> It flickers to life for 1/10th of a second and then dies for a moment

05:21 <Ali> I'm not sure, but odds of getting repairs to that right now is about as good as getting a new monitor

05:21 <Finwe> "Have you tried turning it off and on again?"

05:21 * Ali smacks Finwe

05:22 * Finwe nimbly evades the smack.

05:22 <Ali> And yes, its plugged in

05:22 <Colgate> probably not worth the repair anyways unless it is a high end monitor

05:22 <Ali> Its not that high end

05:22 <Ali> I mean its HD about that's about it

05:23 <Ali> Not 4k or curved or anything fancy

05:23 <Ali> But like I said Colgate, the odds of getting a new monitor is terrible right now

05:23 <Ali> Not a single store I went to had one

05:23 <Ali> And anything online is at least a week out, if not more.

05:32 <Cepheid> Order one through the stores.  They generally tend to get them from the warehouses pretty quickly.

05:32 <Cepheid> In fact, I suspect the reason the stores don't carry much right now is due to lack of demand, what with how difficult it is to visit said stores right now.

06:07 <Ali> Yeah but if it wasn't for the fact that my TV can monitor for now

06:07 <Ali> I'd be without PC/Internet access for who knows how long

06:11 <Koopz> Schism eh, i don't like that hat too much. It may for once be symmetric but the mix of top hat and wild west doesn't suit me

06:13 *** Joins: ConfusionRift (ConfusionRi@Pony-gre.irn.56.193.IP)

06:13 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o ConfusionRift

06:14 <ConfusionRift> Hello everypony.

06:17 * Ali flops over ConfusionRift on a very large monitor for a pc. Hers blew out.

06:19 <Cepheid> Ali, TVs these days are just monitors with a different set of features.  I use a TV as my primary monitor.  I'd like to replace it with a largish 144Hz monitor though.

06:19 <Ali> I honestly don't like it

06:19 <Ali> Its too large, the resolution is bleh

06:19 <Ali> And red comes off more purplish

06:19 * ConfusionRift patpats Ali and her now dead monitor.

06:20 <Ali> Though if it wasn't for the TV, I wouldn't be here now

06:20 <Ali> And I would be in deep dark depressive moods

06:21 <Cepheid> Your system might not be using the native resolution.  Or may be using UI scaling.

06:21 <ConfusionRift> Yeah, when I shift to the TV, it's just really strange. On top of Windows REALLY wanting to move to its native resolution by force, TVs can sometimes not be as consistent with its refresh rate as a monitor.

06:21 <Cepheid> Or, in the case of Windows prior to 10...

06:22 <Ali> This is Windows 10

06:22 <Cepheid> It may be using the native resolution with no scaling.

06:22 <Ali> I mean I don't mind my zoomed in IRC

06:22 <Ali> Just certain games the text is blurry

06:22 <Ali> And I don't want to make THAT even smaller than it already is.

06:22 <ConfusionRift> I prefer zoomed than ant sized. :P

06:23 <ConfusionRift> Yeah, TV scaling can be wonky.

06:23 <ConfusionRift> It can either look blurry or pixelated.

06:24 <ConfusionRift> It depends on the type of TV, resolution, this that, and the other thing, yadda yadda...

06:24 <Cepheid> Right click the desktop.  Display settings.  You can change the resolution and scaling if necessary.  Scaling changes require logging out of your Windows account and back in to fix certain programs.  Just so ya know.

06:26 <Cepheid> Honestly, I like the scaling system, but across software, it needs improvements.

06:27 <ConfusionRift> Emulation is really... yeah... with the scaling. :P

06:27 <Cepheid> Not with respects to that.

06:27 <ConfusionRift> I know.

06:27 <ConfusionRift> That's kind of an issue from the other side.

06:28 <Cepheid> The problem is that a lot of modern software still relies on archaic concepts for positioning widgets.  It is this that causes all the scaling problems.

06:28 <Cepheid> Though, arguably, it shouldn't be.  You can do math to figure out everything.

06:29 <ConfusionRift> I bad at maaath. :P

06:30 <Cepheid> Got a panel, 100 pixels in width.  You place a label at 25 pixels from the left.  At 1x scaling, this would be 100 and 25 respectively.

06:30 <Cepheid> Integer scaling is easy.

06:31 <Cepheid> Non-integer is more troublesome, but with subpixel rendering, it should be possible to get accurate results.

06:33 <Cepheid> There are a lot of cases I probably am not considering which aren't this trivial.

06:34 <Cepheid> Static images, for one.  Plus elements that are custom-drawn.

06:38 <Cepheid> Interestingly, the problem of apps not scaling right is not limited to Windows.

06:40 <Cepheid> Applications using GTK+ version 2, and early versions of 3, exhibit similar problems.  Same for I think, Qt 4 and below.

06:40 *** Quits: FruitNibbler (Eogan@Pony-ip4f0q.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)

06:41 <Cepheid> Hexchat is an example of the GTK+ issue.  It uses GTK+ 2.  As a result its UI doesn't scale right.  Either in Linux DEs or Windows.

06:42 <Cepheid> You can get approximate behaviour with a few settings(Windows or Linux) but it breaks certain things in Hexchat, and also slows performance considerably.

06:43 <Cepheid> Primarily, it breaks positioning of the name-text line.

06:44 <Cepheid> And the menu bars are all forked up.

07:02 * ConfusionRift checks his phone. "...the heck?!"

07:03 <ConfusionRift> Apparently my friend's aunt took a picture of a snake she found. It was a rattlesnake... and that picture looked very close.

07:03 <ConfusionRift> If I can see the snake in super detail... it's waaaay too close.

07:04 <Finwe> Depends on the objective. With proper optics, you can catch the details from quite a distance.

07:05 *** Quits: PinkieShy (coolm@Pony-ck81je.67-212-45-net.sccoast.net) (Connection closed)

07:06 <ConfusionRift> It was a picture taken from a phone. Even with newer phones and camera, it looked suspiciously close. Normally, when zoomed, quality tends to degrade in some way due to focus. Unless they have a very new and expensive phone.

07:08 <Cepheid> Are rattlesnakes common in your area such that people should be aware of them?

07:09 <Cepheid> I know rattlesnakes are dangerous, but I wouldn't know if a snake before me was a rattlesnake if it didn't make any noise for some reason.

07:10 <Cepheid> We don't get rattlesnakes around here.  I'm not even sure if there are snakes native to the region.

07:10 <Finwe> We only have two species.

07:10 <Cepheid> I've never seen a snake in or around the Ottawa valley.  I'm 33 years old.

07:11 <ConfusionRift> Not really, no. There is an open desert area close by, but there's way too much happening here that it tends to scare them off. Not to mention the ridiculously active traffic.

07:11 <Finwe> The common European viper and grass snake.

07:13 <Cepheid> In any case, my point is straightforward.  They likely didn't know it was a rattlesnake, especially if they are not seen very commonly, or at all, in the region that they live in.

07:13 <ConfusionRift> I guess I watched way too many documentaries that I immediately noticed it was a rattlesnake pretty fast.

07:14 <Finwe> Some smooth snakes have been sighted in Åland, but those have been just single individualts.

07:14 <Finwe> *individuals

07:14 * Cepheid checks the NCC.

07:14 <Cepheid> Looks like we have a few varieties of snakes in the Ottawa Valley.

07:15 <Cepheid> http://www.whatsnakeisthat.com/category/region/canada/ontario/

07:15 <Cepheid> We get rattlesnakes apparently.

07:16 <Cepheid> Strange.  Never seen any snakes before in all my life living here in Ontario.

07:16 <ConfusionRift> If you're in a more urban area, then there's less chances of spotting one. The noise, vibrations, and conflicting odors would scare them away. Oh, and some pets too.

07:17 <Cepheid> Granted, I've never lived in the outer edges of the cities I've lived in.

07:17 <Cepheid> Arguably, anyways.

07:17 <Cepheid> If you want to get technical, you can use the pre-almagamated map of Ottawa, and I'd be considered "on the outskirts of the city of Ottawa."

07:18 * ConfusionRift chuckles. "You guys got hognoses." :P

07:18 <Cepheid> But yeah, I'm in a relatively developed area.  That said, you'd think I'd see more wildlife than I do, because if you look at the map of the region..

07:19 <Finwe> Eastern hog-nosed snake. o3o

07:19 * ConfusionRift nods.

07:19 <Ali> 3am, not tired, and not sure what to do at the moment

07:19 <Cepheid> https://www.google.com/maps/place/Orl%C3%A9ans,+Ottawa,+ON/@45.4195584,-75.6352046,24893m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x4cce0dac2c1b5fb5:0x3efcce6e12d476c7!8m2!3d45.4558019!4d-75.5047333 As you can see, there's a huge swath of greenery between Ottawa and Orleans, in the region called Gloucester.

07:19 * Ali flops over ConfusionRift

07:19 <Cepheid> Including the bog trail.

07:20 * Finwe ruffles an Ali.

07:20 <Cepheid> Basically, there's a huge wall of green interspersed with some developed just next door to me.

07:21 <Finwe> Finland really isn't a great place for reptile sighting. Two species of snakes and three lizards.

07:21 <Cepheid> ... Wait, that gravel pit is that large?  I didn't know it was that large.

07:22 * Cepheid used to walk by it when he would take his hour-long walks.

07:22 <Cepheid> Meanwhile, that large bit of greenery around it is basically owned by the RCMP.

07:22 * ConfusionRift huggles Ali.

07:23 <Cepheid> As for my relative location to the greenery...

07:23 <Cepheid> https://www.google.com/maps/place/1752+Aspenview+Way,+Orl%C3%A9ans,+ON+K1C+6S5/@45.4524179,-75.5369399,3698m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x4cce11f62d4c7aab:0x60b2ea39ca1c8ca!8m2!3d45.4512973!4d-75.5275767

07:23 * Cepheid doesn't care if the lot of you knows where he lives.

07:23 <Finwe> Viviparous lizard, sand lizard and deaf adder (Anguis fragilis).

07:23 <Cepheid> You guys aren't about to mess with me in a negative manner, anyways.

07:25 <Cepheid> Marker's also a bit off, to be honest.

07:26 * Cepheid decides to look around. See what there is in terms of stuff nearby to check out.

07:27 <Cepheid> Hum.  Have a church nearby.  Not sure how I feel about that.

07:27 <Cepheid> I don't know why I am surprised about that though, given the area is called Chapel Hill.

07:28 <Cepheid> ... There's an "armory" nearby that does armor and weapons of a medieval style.  What.

07:29 <ConfusionRift> Yeah, you won't see them much. They would likely be closer to the bog trail. Then again, they prefer rockier areas or places where they can sunbathe, hide, and hunt. There's also that highway.

07:30 <Cepheid> Yeah, probably the bog trail, mostly.

07:30 <Cepheid> That said, I wouldn't go searching for snakes there.

07:30 <ConfusionRift> Cepheid: Funny finding some interesting locations nearby through Google Maps? :P

07:30 <Cepheid> It's called a bog trail for a reason.

07:30 * Cepheid has been to the bog trail. It's more a like a long, looping boat dock.

07:30 <Finwe> The large forest north of the river seems promising.

07:30 <Cepheid> And it's humid as hell, and smells.

07:31 <Cepheid> Yeah I am not surprised about the forest area to the north being like that.

07:31 <Cepheid> Most of the population of Canada lives along the border to the US.

07:31 <Cepheid> So just a few hundred kilometers north of the border, you basically hit wildlife.

07:32 <Cepheid> I am still in shock how Canada has so much land available to it, and yet, such a small population.

07:33 <Cepheid> Like, our population is slightly larger than that of the state of California, but we've got several times the area by far.

07:34 <Cepheid> Like, how does that even happen?  How does a state not even 1/10th the area of a country get close to the population of said country?

07:34 <Finwe> The Toronto–Ottawa–Montreal–Québec strip is easily distinguishable in satellite images, and the Vancouver area on the west coast.

07:34 <Cepheid> Hum.  Looking at the world map overall..

07:34 <Cepheid> Alaska is the largest state of the US, isn't it?

07:35 <Finwe> Apart from that, Canada seems to be forest.

07:35 <Cepheid> And yet, Texas would seem inclined to argue *IT* is the largest state.

07:36 <Finwe> Alaska is like 2.5 times the size of Texas.

07:36 <Finwe> Texas was the largest until 1959.

07:36 *** Joins: ConfusionRift2 (ConfusionRi@Pony-qsn.ngp.132.45.IP)

07:36 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o ConfusionRift2

07:36 <Finwe> Lt Cdr ConfusionRift2.

07:36 <Finwe> o7

07:36 *** Quits: ConfusionRift (ConfusionRi@Pony-gre.irn.56.193.IP) (Killed (NickServ (GHOST command used by ConfusionRift2!ConfusionRi@Pony-qsn.ngp.132.45.IP)))

07:37 *** ConfusionRift2 is now known as ConfusionRift

07:37 <ConfusionRift> Who? :P

07:37 <Finwe> o3o

07:37 <ConfusionRift> RAdm. Finwe. (salutes)

07:37 <Cepheid> But yeah.

07:37 <Koopz> RAdm. Finwe o7

07:38 <Cepheid> The further north you go, the more forest you find.  Go far enough north, you'll encounter rocky mountains(Unless you're out west, then you'll encounter them much sooner), then tundra, then ice.

07:38 <Cepheid> That said, despite all this space, Canada overall's population density is very low.

07:38 <ConfusionRift> Then a bit of green, and then a lot more ice, and then splash.

07:38 <ConfusionRift> And I think that's good.

07:39 <Cepheid> A few major settlements up north.  Edmonton, Alberta, for example.

07:39 <Cepheid> But even that doesn't extend to the far north, like in the territories and the like.

07:40 <Cepheid> Ancestral reasons-be-damned, I'm still not 100% certain why anyone would want to live in the Northwest Territories, the Yukon, or Nunavut.

07:40 * ConfusionRift shrugs.

07:41 <Finwe> Cepheid: Is that agricultural land in southern parts of Saskatchewan?

07:41 <Cepheid> Even if settlers didn't come and "claim the land" from the natives, I doubt the native populations in those regions would have ever developed any further technologically, socially, and such.

07:41 <Cepheid> They'd at most, provide a source of pelts and food for other regions.  Fishing villages, as it were.

07:41 <Finwe> Roughly the triangle with corners at Edmonton, Calgary and Winnipeg.

07:42 <Cepheid> Ah, yeah.  That region.

07:42 <Cepheid> Much of central Canada is farms.

07:42 <Cepheid> It's a region generally referred to as "The Prairies."

07:42 <Cepheid> They are notoriously flat.

07:43 <Cepheid> Lots of farmland out there.  A LOT.

07:43 <Ali> ConfusionRift, its not splash

07:43 * Cepheid has gone through it. Back in the early 2000s, around 2005 or 2006 I think, he went on a trip out west via van to Vancouver, BC, with his family.

07:43 <Ali> Its SPLOOSH

07:43 <ConfusionRift> Ooooh, sploooosh. :P

07:43 <Ali> KER BOOOM

07:43 <Ali> SPLOOOOSH

07:44 <Cepheid> Some of the complaints made by the people out in those regions are legitimate, despite what the Federal government and people across the country think or say.

07:44 <Cepheid> Road maintenance is a major issue.

07:44 <Cepheid> The moment you cross into Saskatchewan, it becomes apparent.

07:45 <ConfusionRift> Gonna guess Crater City?

07:45 <Cepheid> Pothole city like you wouldn't believe.  And detours everywhere.

07:45 <Cepheid> This was on the Trans-Canada Highway, as well.

07:45 * ConfusionRift laughs, too familiar with that.

07:45 <Cepheid> And it showed almost immediately after we crossed out of Ontario.

07:45 <Cepheid> Not even 100km past the border, a detour.

07:45 <Cepheid> And up to that point the highway was in excellent condition.

07:49 <Ali> I remember here we had potholes so bad

07:49 <Ali> There was a gag campain to adopt a pothole and even one guy planted a tree in a pothole as a gag to actually fill it in.

07:50 <Finwe> Hot poles.

07:51 <Finwe> Erm, it's snowing.

07:51 * Finwe throws a snowball at ConfusionRift.

07:52 <ConfusionRift> In P.R., they would put most of their attention on the interstate and high traffic roads. Any other would be left a mess. So there were potholes that were never fixed for years, and still aren't fixed.

07:52 <Cepheid> Finwe, what is the correct way to express a number such as 25.256 being rounded to 25.26?  "Rounded to the nearest two decimal places"?  I don't use certain mathematical phrases and such enough that I continuously forget and have to remember.

07:52 * ConfusionRift gets hit by snowball.

07:53 <Ali> Well there was a side road here, that hadn't been repaired since like 2000

07:53 * ConfusionRift decides to retaliate... with another snowball on Finwe. :P

07:53 <Ali> And they FINALLY tore it up and fixed it.

07:53 <Finwe> Cepheid: Rounded to precision of two decimals, I think.

07:53 <Cepheid> Thank you.

07:54 <Finwe> The other precision usually being that of significant digits.

07:54 <Cepheid> That too, I need some help with clarification on.  I've seen conflicting definitions in math courses and from other students, including TAs.

07:55 <Cepheid> I assume when they say, "to 5 significant digits" I assume they mean, say, a number 25.12345678 being truncated/rounded to "25.123"

07:55 <Cepheid> But I've gotten mixed responses to that.

07:55 * ConfusionRift whispers to Ali. "We are talking about roads that are still used since the 90's, some even 80's. They're still not maintained." :P

07:55 <Finwe> Significant digits are counted beginning from the most signinficant non-zero digit.

07:56 <Cepheid> So I'm right, then.

07:56 <Ali> Might as well dump gravel onto it and make it a gravel road

07:56 <Cepheid> So for example, 65535.12345 would be 65535.  6553.512345 would be 6553.5, and so on.

07:56 <Cepheid> Thank you for clarifying that for me.  I feel like I learned something today that I should have learned decades ago.

07:56 <ConfusionRift> Roads that have claimed cars, so you would see tire pieces, shock parts, and even mufflers.

07:56 <Finwe> And you would use the usual rounding convention, unless stated otherwise.

07:56 <Cepheid> Of course.

07:57 <Finwe> E.g. 24 744 rounded to the precision of two significant digits would be 25 000.

07:57 <Ali> The tires are looking like 50p pieces again

07:57 <ConfusionRift> Oh yeah, chunks of the drivetrain as well.

07:58 <Cepheid> Speaking of rounding..

08:00 <ConfusionRift> Hehehe.

08:01 <Cepheid> Actually, you know what, nevermind.

08:01 <Cepheid> I just answered my own question in writing out said question.

08:01 <Finwe> What did Mama Square Root say to Baby Square Root after he had behaved badly? – You're rounded.

08:02 * Finwe hides under Ali.

08:02 * Ali baps Finwe nosie

08:02 <Cepheid> And even then, it appears to be dependent on the rounding approach used by the mathematical system anyways.

08:02 * Finwe scrunchymuzzles.

08:02 <Finwe> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rounding

08:02 <Cepheid> Yeah, I know.

08:03 <ConfusionRift> Oh! So THAT'S why this was happening. I kept having this issue of websites not showing pictures or videos, like on Twitter. Apparently, the other server was causing this issue.

08:03 <Finwe> Huh, a lot of methods, mostly because of trying to cope with the bias.

08:03 <Cepheid> Yeah, their CDN was borked Rifty.

08:03 <Cepheid> Finwe, yeah.  The only reason I was gonna ask a question is because there appears to be many different ways of rounding, based on the field of mathematics used.

08:03 <ConfusionRift> Be right back.

08:03 *** Quits: ConfusionRift (ConfusionRi@Pony-qsn.ngp.132.45.IP) (Quit: Recharging the batteries. Laters! *shutdown*)

08:04 *** Joins: ConfusionRift (ConfusionRi@Pony-6c3.irn.56.193.IP)

08:04 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o ConfusionRift

08:04 <ConfusionRift> YEP, that was the problem.

08:04 <Cepheid> I prefer the definition of 0 <= x < 1/2 becomes 0.  1/2 <= x < 1 becomes 1.

08:04 <Cepheid> Of course, the problem here is how to handle this with negative numbers.

08:05 <Cepheid> In which case I do the towards-zero approach.  So -1/2 < x <= 0 becomes 0.  -1 < x <= -1/2 becomes -1.

08:07 <Cepheid> Sometimes I feel like I should take basic algebra all over again.

08:07 <Cepheid> Seems like there's a lot of holes in my education that shouldn't be there.

08:08 <Cepheid> I blame it on doing distance education, but there's no evidence to support that attending an actual school would have resulted in any difference.

08:08 <Cepheid> Especially since Ontario reportedly has some pretty low math test results.

08:10 * Cepheid now needs to resolve a distinction issue. He needs to figure out the best way to express the differences between an entity that interacts with the solid world around them, but does not fly, an entity that interacts with the solid world around them, but does fly, and an entity that does not interact with the solid world, and flies.

08:10 <Cepheid> Why?  Because collision detection.

08:10 <Cepheid> Each entity type has different collision detection approaches.

08:11 <Ali> Well, almost time for Terraria 1.4

08:11 * ConfusionRift nods.

08:11 <Cepheid> Simplest case is obviously "doesn't collide with world, but flies."

08:11 <Cepheid> ConfusionRift, you're familiar with this one.

08:11 <ConfusionRift> Thinking on trying to beat Calamitas before then.

08:11 * Cepheid gets really, really close to ConfusionRift's ear. Whispers the word "bats."

08:12 <ConfusionRift> 0_0

08:12 * ConfusionRift swings whips wildly. "AAAAaaaaah!"

08:12 <Cepheid> Bats don't collide with the world, outside of their rest state.

08:12 <Cepheid> And even then, they aren't interacting with it.

08:12 <ConfusionRift> It's just a change of sprite.

08:13 <Cepheid> Change of sprite, and an algorithm that picks a spot to stop moving at.  Yeah.

08:13 <Finwe> Just give them a good batting.

08:13 <Ali> Or smack them with the Galaxy Sword

08:13 <Ali> Frankly Medusa heads were worse than NES bats

08:13 <ConfusionRift> Or destroy EVERYTHING with the lag rifle. :P

08:14 <Cepheid> As for why there's a distinction between entities that collide with the world and fly, and entities that collide with the world and don't fly, it has to do with gravity being applied.

08:14 <Ali> Or just cause sprite flicker and just walk right thru it!

08:14 <Ali> I swore on the NES version of Megaman 2

08:14 <Cepheid> Actually, no, that's wrong.  It's more about the collisions involved.

08:14 <Ali> That if you could cause sprite flicker on those little crusher things in Metal Man's stage

08:14 <Cepheid> An entity that walks along the ground will interact with the world a bit differently than one that doesn't.

08:15 <Ali> You could just jump thru the chain and not worry about being crushed

08:15 <Cepheid> In the case of one that flies, well, all you need to do is determine if a collision occurs, and have the AI react.

08:15 <Cepheid> In the case of an entity that walks, well..

08:15 * Ali is just rambling off on her own topic, please ignores

08:15 <Cepheid> It needs to be able to walk up and down slopes.

08:15 <Cepheid> Which is where the difficulty comes into play.

08:18 <Cepheid> Right then.  That means I can do some repurposing.

08:18 <ConfusionRift> Ali: Oh yeah. MM2 had issues with lag and such, so some things would flicker and momentarily not exist.

08:18 <Cepheid> The existing collision algorithm works for flying entities that collide with objects.

08:18 <ConfusionRift> Or the game wasn't sure what to do.

08:18 <Cepheid> It doesn't handle any special scenarios.  Just reports "You hit something."

08:18 <Ali> Well like the mecha dragon fight

08:19 <Cepheid> Yeah, the NES and it's flickering problem was... troublesome for some games.

08:19 <Ali> When it spams the fire projectile at you, it just kinda phases thru you

08:19 <Ali> But you have to understand

08:19 <Cepheid> Arguably, that is a fairness design.

08:19 <Ali> They hardcoded two levels on the same data

08:20 <Ali> How they managed that I don't know

08:20 <Cepheid> If you can't see something, it shouldn't be able to hurt you, especially if it's due to hardware limitations.

08:20 <Ali> See the emulations of MM2 got me many times

08:20 <Cepheid> It's likely not a part of the level data, that logic.

08:20 <Ali> cause I was so used to jumping thru the chain

08:20 <Ali> That when it didn't flicker out of existance, I took damage

08:21 <Ali> Cepheid, you've seen the thing in Megaman 2

08:21 <Ali> Where if you can glitch out of the boss door in 4 of the boss stages

08:21 <Cepheid> It's probably part of the underlying engine.  If there are too many sprites, it doesn't consider the collisions for the extra sprites that it doesn't draw.

08:21 <ConfusionRift> >0_0>

08:21 <Ali> Its takes you to a screwed up version of a Wily stage

08:21 <Cepheid> That's not because of level data or anything.

08:21 <Cepheid> It's likely the game picking out random data because it doesn't know what to do.

08:22 <Cepheid> Is it the same level that it sends you to?

08:22 <Ali> Every time it triggers the glitch

08:22 <Ali> Depending on the stage its executed in

08:22 <Ali> Its always the same Wily Stage

08:22 <Cepheid> So same layout, just garbage graphics

08:22 <Cepheid> ?

08:22 <Ali> Eeyup

08:22 * ConfusionRift gets annoyed. "Why is the jungle right next to the ocean?! A small world was a bad idea."

08:23 <Finwe> !link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=widBxKSrNYs

08:23 <DerpyBot> I need to ask Twilight about that one.

08:23 <DerpyBot> Twilight told me this video is about Megaman 2 - Boss Gate Glitch

08:23 <Finwe> This?

08:23 <ConfusionRift> Yep.

08:23 <Ali> Yep

08:23 <Ali> See getting the glitch in Air Man's stage

08:23 <Cepheid> I can make a guess as to what's happening.

08:23 <Ali> Will ALWAYS glitch you to Wily 2

08:24 <Ali> The thing about it is

08:24 <Cepheid> Let me rephrase my earlier question.

08:24 <Ali> That once you get to the boss room

08:24 <Ali> Since the game thinks its air man's stage and not Wily 2

08:24 <Cepheid> Every stage in which it happens, does it lead to the same Wily stage, not "the same stage for the level that the bug occurs in."

08:24 <Ali> It will not spawn the Wily 2 boss

08:24 <Ali> Like I said

08:24 <Cepheid> That is, in every level the bug occurs, does it lead to Wily 2?

08:24 <Ali> Every time the glitch happens in Air Man's stage

08:24 <Ali> It will ALWAYS be Wily 2

08:24 <Cepheid> I know.

08:25 <Cepheid> I'm trying to figure out the underlying details.

08:25 <Cepheid> The graphics are incorrect, that much is apparent.

08:25 <Ali> Other bosses lead to different ones

08:25 <Cepheid> Okay, thanks.

08:25 <Ali> I think Heat leads to Wily 1, Not sure as I've never been able to dupe the glitch

08:25 <Cepheid> Then that throws out one theory about it.

08:25 <Cepheid> In this case though?

08:25 <ConfusionRift> Thought it was a failsafe?

08:25 <Cepheid> Not a failsafe.

08:25 <Cepheid> If it was a failsafe, they'd all lead to the same room.

08:26 <Cepheid> A failsafe would be like "Okay, I can't find this room, so let's go to room 0."

08:26 <Cepheid> At least, a sane one that doesn't crash the game outright.

08:26 <Ali> Yep, Wily 1 is linked to Heat Man

08:27 <Cepheid> This looks closer to the case of the system accessing adjacent level data.

08:27 <Ali> ! link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvtXONUGOGs

08:27 <Cepheid> Levels are usually packed in close together, in no particular order.

08:27 <Ali> I screw dat ups

08:27 <Ali> But anyway, that's the same glitch, just a differnt boss

08:27 * Finwe noms on the extra space.

08:28 <Ali> As you can see, it leads to a differnent glitched out area

08:28 <Ali> Which is Wily 1

08:29 <Cepheid> There's a few theories I can come up with as to why it happens.

08:30 <Cepheid> The one off the top of my head is to treat each screen of gameplay as a "room" with an associated integer number.  0, 1, 2, 3, and so on.

08:30 <Cepheid> At the edge of each room are transitions that contain a number, that indicates what room the player is meant to appear in when they hit that transition.

08:30 <Cepheid> Or, some value to indicate "death pit" or "no transition"

08:31 <Cepheid> For the cases where touching the edge does not result in a transition, such as falling in a pit, or hitting the top of the screen.

08:31 <Cepheid> Now, common sense would dictate that all of these edge transitions be set to some default "Don't transition" state.

08:32 <Cepheid> But assume that's not the case.  And that they have to be set explicitly.  What values get crammed into those transition states in rooms where the player cannot, logically, touch the edge?

08:32 <Cepheid> Usual result is garbage data left in memory.

08:33 <Cepheid> So, you're playing, fighting a boss.  Then voila, a bug occurs, and you touch the edge that you're not meant to touch.  It goes to read that garbage value, which says "load room X", where X is a random value.

08:33 <Cepheid> If it so happens to reference a room for a Wily stage, it'll load that room.

08:33 <Cepheid> But, since the tileset loaded in memory is incorrect, it'll look all wrong.

08:34 <Cepheid> If it's a random garbage value in memory, then the question becomes "why is it always the same room?"

08:34 <Cepheid> Simplest answer I can respond with is that what you're seeing is the random values from the level editor, saved into the ROM.

08:35 <Cepheid> Which will be static, every time the relevant room is loaded.

08:35 <Cepheid> This is the most likely cause, to be honest.

08:35 <Cepheid> I'd have to look at the assembly language code to verify, though.

08:35 <Cepheid> Long story short, what you're seeing is probably a bug in their level editor.

08:36 <Cepheid> And this is likely, since I recall for a fact that the NES Megaman games were notorious for re-using room layouts a lot, just with different tilesets and colours.

08:37 <Ali> Still how is another level layered on the boss door

08:37 <Ali> Cause the funny thing is

08:37 <Cepheid> A door existing in one room may, by default, force a door to exist in the room that it leads to.

08:37 <Ali> You don't enter the Wily stages by a door

08:37 <Ali> You teleport into them

08:38 <Cepheid> There's one other theory, too.

08:38 <Ali> But how does getting ejected thru a boss door by a glitch

08:38 <Cepheid> Looking at the bug in action..

08:38 <Ali> Suddenly dump you into another stage

08:38 <Cepheid> It looks like doors are programmed to transition in one direction.

08:38 <Cepheid> Also meant to only be activated from one direction.

08:38 <Ali> Yeah you're not supposed to be able to go back thru the boss gates

08:39 <Cepheid> Yeah.  And I'm not sure if there are cases in the games where doors go in other d-  No, wait, Megaman 3 had downward doors, did it not?

08:39 <Ali> Megaman 1 had upwards doors

08:39 <Cepheid> Right, so doors can face any orientation, then.

08:39 <Ali> Cause you climbed a ladder into Elecman's boss room

08:40 <Ali> Or wait

08:40 <Cepheid> The door is likely programmed with an ID of the connecting room, and a direction it is meant to be interacted with.

08:40 <Ali> it wasn't a boss door, its just a gate closed over the ladder

08:40 <Ali> ANd Megaman 1 had some funky stuff

08:40 <Cepheid> When you interact with it from that direction, it loads a room, then  scrolls in the relevant direction.

08:40 <Ali> Like if you could jump up at a ladder that was at the bottom of the screen

08:40 <Ali> You could jump from the top of the screen and grab hold of the ladder on the bottom

08:41 <Cepheid> If the doors in the boss rooms were just placed there for aesthetics..

08:41 <Cepheid> They likely have invalid garbage data as to where they transition to.

08:41 <Cepheid> Activate it, it'll send you to an invalid spot.

08:41 <ConfusionRift> Apparently, yeah, kinda like that. When trying to do the glitch, it seems the game thinks the area is cleared and initiates the transition to the next corresponding stage in the game's memory... that being a Wily stage. Since the game still loads the previous stages sprites, it creates this mess. The reason why they don't change is because... it's technically part of the same level.

08:42 <Cepheid> Basically, it looks like the game is thinking the player touched the door from the side that it can be activated from.  A right-facing door.

08:42 <Ali> The NES was some amazing things

08:42 <Ali> The doors in Megaman are NEVER activated from the right hand side

08:42 <Cepheid> It even shows the behavioral logic messing up by clearing the visual data on the right-hand side, as if the door was on the right-hand side.

08:42 <Ali> At least in the NES games

08:43 <Ali> Yeah it shows a glitchgate transitioning to the Wily stage

08:43 <Cepheid> So for some reason, a specific set of motions causes the game to think the player activated the gate by touching it from it's left-hand side.

08:43 <Ali> And somehow transisions to a Wily stage that's in the similar data area

08:43 <Cepheid> And because it's possible that in the boss rooms, the doors are just there for aesthetic reasons, assuming the game just doesn't automatically generate the door sprites during the transition..

08:44 <Cepheid> It loads random data that was never set to a valid value, and loads the associated room.

08:44 <Ali> When you enter the boss gates

08:44 <Ali> It opens on the screen prior

08:44 <Ali> And then pushes you into the boss room

08:44 <Ali> It then proceeds to close the boss gate and starts the boss fight

08:44 <Cepheid> Yeah.

08:45 <Cepheid> Still, it's an edge case they didn't account for.

08:45 <Ali> Well the NES did have some strange things happen

08:45 <Ali> You know about the Pac Man overflow right?

08:45 <Cepheid> That's not the NES explicitly.

08:46 <Cepheid> In many cases, these kinds of things are the result of programmer error, and accessing random memory.

08:46 <Ali> The game can't handle Lvl 256 so it just garbages half of the map and thus causes the stage to become unplayable

08:46 <Cepheid> Yeah, it can't handle 256 because the level value is an unsigned byte with a range of 0 to 255.

08:46 <Ali> Not quite

08:47 <Ali> What happens is the game reads it as Lvl 0

08:47 <Cepheid> If you try to add 1 to 255 to get the next level, it'll overflow and become 0.

08:47 <Cepheid> Yeah.

08:47 <Cepheid> It's an overflow bug.

08:47 <Cepheid> That's a programmer error.

08:47 <Ali> And this causses the game to think the game is on stage 0

08:47 <Cepheid> Mmhmm.

08:47 <Ali> And draws so many things it causes the normal map to get drawn fruits

08:47 <Cepheid> And if the logic for loading level data is something like (LevelDataOffset - 1) * SizeOfLevelInBytes..

08:47 <Ali> But after awhile it just turns into garbage data

08:48 <Cepheid> Well, the data at (0 - 1) * SizeOfLevelInBytes will be loaded.  Which is not valid.

08:48 <Ali> Well what happened is the overflow causes the fruit data at the bottom of the screen

08:48 <Cepheid> Mmhmm.

08:48 <Ali> Instead of just trying to draw 7 fruits

08:48 <Ali> its drawing over 200 of them

08:48 <Cepheid> The crash meanwhile is simply either from drawing too many sprites, or attempting to draw a sprite outside the visual area.

08:48 <Ali> Mainly cause its reading the data as Lvl 0

08:48 <Cepheid> More likely the former.

08:48 <Ali> Its not a crash

08:49 <Ali> Its just there's so much garbage data now

08:49 <Cepheid> Consoles of the day seemed to handle drawing outside of the visual area better than PCs at the time.

08:49 <Ali> That half of the map got overwritten with junk data

08:49 <Cepheid> PCs, it would cause the program to crash.  DOOM was notorious for this.

08:49 <Ali> Cause the game starts to try and draw fruits into the hexes that the map is supposed to be on.

08:50 <Ali> But I'm rambling

08:50 <Cepheid> And yet, even if the map itself were messed up, visually, it shouldn't affect the logic of the game.  That is, dependent on how it was coded.

08:50 <Ali> It has nothing to do with the wierd glitch that megaman has

08:50 <Cepheid> Many games, the visual component is distinct from the logic component.

08:51 <Ali> The problem is

08:51 <Ali> Garbage data has no collision

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08:51 <Cepheid> You can have a map load correctly, but not render correctly, but the game will still function as if the map was loaded correctly.

08:51 <Ali> So thus it counts it as a wall

08:51 <Cepheid> Yeah.

08:51 <Cepheid> It was loading garbage data under the hood.

08:51 <Ali> Since half of the map in pac man was destroyed by garbage data

08:51 <Cepheid> I'm actually curious as to why only half of the map.

08:51 <Ali> And you can't eat the required dots to complete the stage, cause half of them don't exist

08:52 <Ali> Cepheid, its cause of the overflow data stops after 255 fruits

08:53 <Ali> The game thinks that the number of fruits is supposed to be 0 minus the level number

08:53 <Ali> Since the level number is 256, it overflows and well, it ruins the game

08:53 <Cepheid> Yeah, but there's a number of weird oddities with the whole concept I can't resolve.

08:53 <Ali> But again, getting to Lvl 256 in Pac Man is a test of luck and so many other things

08:53 <Cepheid> As far as I know, the map is always the same on every stage of Pac Man, right?

08:53 <Cepheid> At least, the layout of it.

08:54 <Ali> For the original one yes

08:54 <Ali> The map never changes, just how the ghosts react and how the power pellets effect them

08:55 <Cepheid> Then all that's being loaded is information on the ghost types, power pellets, and number of fruits.  Not layout data, or anything of the sort.  The map itself, the layout of the dots, that should have all been fine.  Unless...  Ah, I think I understand what's going on.

08:57 <Cepheid> Likely some form of buffer overflow.  A buffer for information on the fruits and where they are, when they show up, etc, is likely close to the map data itself.  When the bug occurs, there's probably a buffer overrun occurring, writing directly into the map data, corrupting it.  The reason it stops halfway is that some condition is probably met just as it reaches the halfway point, and the game tries to progress with it's

08:57 <Cepheid> logic after that point.

08:57 <Ali> !link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKKfW8X9uYk

08:57 <DerpyBot> I need to ask Twilight about that one.

08:57 <DerpyBot> Twilight told me this video is about Pac-Man Kill Screen Explained

08:57 <Cepheid> Eh.

08:57 <Ali> That's the video Cepheid

08:57 <Cepheid> I'll watch it later.

08:58 * Cepheid is a tad busy to be honest.

08:58 <Ali> Its fine

08:58 <Cepheid> As for the Megaman 2 case, I'd have to examine the ROM and assembly code.

08:59 <Cepheid> But that'd require a bit more work than necessary, since I'd then need to figure out the memory map of the NES itself.

08:59 <Cepheid> I had enough trouble with that regarding EO3 and the NDS.

08:59 <Cepheid> Put simply, the memory for a console is mapped such that certain things appear at certain addresses.  Peripherals, various hardware functions, etc.

09:00 <Cepheid> It's not a case of "Just look at the ROM and start executing."

09:01 <Cepheid> It has to initialize the system memory to defaults, check for the existence of a cartridge, access the ROM on that cartridge, and then load or map it into system memory at some static address.  Depends on the hardware.  Following that, the system issues an instruction called a jump instruction to that address, from which execution of the game starts.

09:01 <Cepheid> Really interesting to look at.

09:02 <ConfusionRift> Okay... seems someone explained it. The fruits at the bottom correspond to a stage. [Fruit 1 for Stage 1, Fruit 1 & Fruit 2 for Stage 2], which work by a range of 8 sprites total. These are removed and added once the display table is filled. [Stage 9 = removal of Stage 1 fruit. and Stage 9 fruit].

09:03 <ConfusionRift> Eventually, after a point, the stage fruit is a key, and these begin to remove and replace the other sprites. This work by how the game manages sprites on the counter by range.

09:04 <Cepheid> Starting to sound like a buffer overflow error.

09:04 * Cepheid has one collision case left to resolve before he can start implementing the new code. And he calls it the Butt Monster Collision.

09:05 <ConfusionRift> Well, ultimately, yeah.

09:06 <Cepheid> The Butt Monster Collision is a special case.  In La-Mulana, you're familiar with the butt monsters in the Graveyard of the Giants, I presume, Rifty?

09:06 <ConfusionRift> The stage tanks that barely move and hurt a lot?

09:07 <Cepheid> Yes.

09:08 <Cepheid> They are technically ground monsters.  But they can float up off the ground and fly forward a bit, and then land.  With my current setup, I'm not sure how something like that would be implemented.

09:11 <Cepheid> Simplest way is to refactor the system, and add a flag boolean flag "affected by gravity" which can be changed by the AI.

09:11 <ConfusionRift> I suppose it would change how the entity works by transition. So, it would follow a similar function to any other enemy. Randomly, it would switch to a "flight" function, which would work similar to a bat in flight. One it finds a suitable surface, it would change sprites and change functions to a ground function.

09:12 <Cepheid> It's just my current setup basically applies the force of gravity to entities every tick.  If that is to be counteracted by the entity, it'd either have to have some sort of flag to disable gravity temporarily, or simply apply the negation of gravity to itself.

09:13 <ConfusionRift> But unlike a bat, it has to keep its collision. So that way it can detect the ground and not just phase through.

09:13 <Cepheid> Less that issue, and more how physics are meant to be applied.

09:13 * ConfusionRift shrugs.

09:14 <Cepheid> If I apply gravity to every entity that isn't a flyer, then when the entity tries to lift itself off to fly for a bit, gravity would just pull it back down, unless the AI counteracted it.  Which, actually, may be the best idea.

09:14 <Cepheid> Oh for the love of, cats, get out.

09:16 <ConfusionRift> It would be better for the AI to handle it, yeah. Otherwise, you're gonna be trying to balance all of it with each new entity.

09:17 * ConfusionRift booples Ali. "Funny how little things like 'one number off' can make such a mess." :P

09:17 <Cepheid> I still need to do some refactoring, though.  For my slope processing code, I need to figure out a way to determine if the entity in question is touching the ground before I try to move them.

09:18 <ConfusionRift> It's why I sometimes like corruptor runs. Simply because they can correspond to something else, and change the game entirely.

09:18 <Ali> Well only cause things back then weren't ment to go over 255

09:18 <Ali> Overflow errors are much more uncommon now due to how much memory things have

09:18 <Ali> But they shoved so much data into kilobytes that its hard to believe those were games

09:19 <Cepheid> They can still occur with ease, actually.

09:20 <Cepheid> A byte is 0-255, a word is 0-65535, a double word is 0-4.2 billion or so.  A quad words is 0 to some number I'm not bothering to remember.

09:20 <Cepheid> These are the usual data types we have access to.

09:20 <Cepheid> Alongside floating point numbers that are 32-bits and 64-bits.

09:20 <Cepheid> An overflow is easy to trigger on many of them.

09:20 <ConfusionRift> Actually... it kinda reminds me of the Sonic 1 lives glitch. It's possible to die, but make the game thing you're still active. So you get a game over, but restart as if you just died, rather than sending you to the continue screen. And now you got 255 lives. :P

09:23 <Cepheid> Basically, if you try to multiply two variables of the same type, and store the result in another variable of the same type, you run the risk of overflow.

09:23 <Cepheid> 16 and 17, both easily representable by an unsigned byte, for example, will result in 272, which cannot be represented by an unsigned byte.

09:24 <Cepheid> It'll be fine in an unsigned word, though, which is 2 bytes.

09:24 * ConfusionRift points at Disgaea for a second.

09:25 <Cepheid> Meanwhile, the same problem occurs with words.  255 by 256 comes out to larger than an unsigned word.

09:25 <Cepheid> Meanwhile, unsigned double words... 65535 by 65536.  And so on, and so on.

09:25 <Cepheid> Floating point, it's a bit harder to overflow.

09:26 <Cepheid> Instead, your concern there is inaccuracy.

09:26 <Cepheid> Larger the number, less inaccurate it actually is.

09:27 <Cepheid> 32-bit floating point values have precision to around 7 significant digits.  Thus, you can represent the number 1,234,567 exactly, but you can't represent the number 12,345,678 exactly.

09:29 <AppleDash> It gets more complicated than that sometimes :p

09:29 <Cepheid> Indeed.

09:29 <Cepheid> But it's a simple example.

09:31 <Cepheid> The same problem occurs with 64-bit floating point.  Larger range though.  I don't recall the exact number of digits, though, or how to calculate them.

09:31 <Cepheid> Wikipedia says 15-17.

09:31 <Cepheid> That said, the overall number range is much, much larger than the integer types, regardless.  Assuming you don't mind the loss of accuracy.

09:32 <Cepheid> With them, you can represent numbers that are trailed by like, several hundreds of zeros.

09:34 <Cepheid> It's this limited accuracy, along with other issues, that results in a number of different physics engine problems.

09:35 *** Joins: matttheshadowman (matthewhowa@Pony-650.0ec.238.89.IP)

09:38 <Cepheid> I need to do an experiment regarding motion of objects in a 2D game.

09:38 <Cepheid> Actually no.  Thinking about it visually suggests the experiment would not work as expected.

09:42 <Cepheid> Ah, that's a solution...

09:58 * Finwe noms on AppleDash's tail.

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10:23 *** matttheshadowman_ is now known as matttheshadowman

10:47 * Cepheid takes a break for lunch, a weak coffee, and some reading.

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11:07 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Calpain: Morning Discussion #1928 [ http://tinyurl.com/ybe4lhwt ]

11:11 <Cepheid> I am surprised the Foundation is still trying to kill 682.  On top of that, it's clear tissue sample effects do not correlate to full-body effects.  I have no idea why they keep testing stuff on tissue samples, when applying methods to the full thing has been known to have widely different effects.

11:14 <ConfusionRift> Should I point out of the things they have stored within their walls? I'm sure we all have gone at some point and said "why are they keeping that thing alive?!".

11:16 <ConfusionRift> At this point it's being proven that it's nearly indestructible, and that effect between its body, tissue, and anything that it leaves behind after each experiment have diverse effects. Also, some of them are not exactly the smartest in terms of decision making and evaluations.

11:19 <Cepheid> Indeed.  682 though has demonstrated that even Thaumiel class entities cannot and will not deal with it.  Whatever 682 is exactly, it exists because of what appears to be some sort of cosmic, infinite curse.  Existence will not allow it to die.  A better option at this point would be to launch it into space and forget about it, since it cannot and will not die under any circumstances until something or someone decides that its sent

11:20 <ConfusionRift> Actually, I think it'll breach whatever facility they have in space, slowly freeze and crash straight back to Earth, and go back to the SCP facility just to level it to the ground with everything/everyone in it.

11:20 <Cepheid> True.

11:21 <Cepheid> It is, unfortunately, extremely pissed off at the Foundation now.

11:21 <ConfusionRift> Who wouldn't? :P

11:21 <Cepheid> If they had kinda just launched it into space in the first place, it likely would not have had the animosity that'd drive it to want to kill the Foundation so much that it'd return even if you sent it into space.

11:22 <Cepheid> Aaanyhoo.  *Gets back to work.*

11:22 <ConfusionRift> The only time it showed some other emotion was with the slime experiment... and that got real bad really fast, landing the poor thing on its (bleep) list with the others in the Foundation.

11:23 <Cepheid> The list has since expanded and a lot more is on 682's ****-list.

11:23 <Cepheid> Hmm.

11:31 <Cepheid> So, in a tweet I was writing, I was about to explain why I separated collision and visuals for tiles.

11:31 <Cepheid> It just dawned on me that there's no reason for this.

11:31 <Cepheid> ... Or, no, actually wait, there is.

11:31 <Cepheid> I forgot why I did this.  It affords me the ability to create invisible platforms and such.

11:33 <Cepheid> Basically, it affords me the ability to create hidden obstacles, platforms, and, in more intricate cases..

11:33 <Cepheid> Paths through damaging fields.

11:34 <Cepheid> For example, you enter a room, there's a pool of lava.  You see it, and think "I better not touch that", right?

11:34 <Cepheid> Well, in reality, the pool is a visual effect.  Underneath the hood, there are no damage or liquid collision tiles.

11:34 <Cepheid> It's just open air, with the appearance of a pool of lava.  And there's a secret in it. o3o

11:38 <ConfusionRift> Oh... and the creature is smart too. Great. It's violent, AND it learns how to adapt to a problem and use it against others. Yeah... it just gets worse.

11:39 <Cepheid> Heh.

11:39 * Cepheid needs to rewrite his polygon code a bit. Mostly just needs to remove the origin stuff, and change the intersection testing functions to require provision of transformations.

11:40 <Cepheid> 'Afore I go changing things though, let's see what MonoGame provides to me for this kinda stuff.

11:42 <Cepheid> Yeah, MonoGame provides a Matrix class, which is the closest thing to a "Transform" class that I can pass around.  What I don't like though is that all of it's damned methods are static.

11:42 <Cepheid> Which means it was designed to be immutable, unchanging.

11:43 <Cepheid> You recreated it every time you wanted a new change.

11:43 <Cepheid> Still.  Might be the best approach to use it.

11:44 * Cepheid needs to test something.

11:48 * ConfusionRift chuckles. "So they thought that testing with a miniature black hole was a bad idea."

12:00 <Cepheid> Let's see... Okay, it's a struct.  Good.

12:02 * Cepheid investigates which is faster for applying a transformation to a list of elements.

12:07 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Drawfriend - Equestria Girls / Anthro MLP Art Gallery #194 [ http://tinyurl.com/yagcunlg ]

12:09 <Cepheid> Huh.  Looks like I can only do it one way.

12:12 <Cepheid> Oh look.

12:12 <Cepheid> I can't multiply a MonoGame Vector2 by a MonoGame Matrix.

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12:47 <Cepheid> Right, I've seen enough here.  I know what needs to be done.

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13:23 <Cepheid> SCP-4455 is a good one.

13:27 <Cepheid> As my headaches are always in and around the left eye, I wonder if removal of said eye would alleviate the symptoms in any way, shape or form.

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13:48 * Schism awakens.

13:48 <Cepheid> Morning.

13:49 <Schism> Hoi.  Bleh, slept a long time, but it feels insufficient.

13:50 <Cepheid> I know the feeling.

14:01 <Schism> "No one has recovered the memories of a body this old before.  I will do it for science.  I will do it for the fame.  And for money.  Lots of money."

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14:19 <Schism> Cepheid: You might like 'Harbourmaster'.  It's an interesting webcomic about the social dynamics between alien races and the technological and sociological disparities which drive their interactions, especially as it relates to one not subsuming another by making them 'inferior'.

14:20 <Schism> Naturally, humanity is one of those races.  o3o

14:49 * Cepheid gets a container of juice, a glass, and sits at the kitchen table sipping juice. He doesn't feel okay right now. Something weird is going on inside and around his head.

14:49 <Schism> What variety of juice?

14:49 <Schism> And whurp.  I've had a few days like that.

14:50 <Cepheid> Lemon-lime.  I also seem to have a fever.  100.1F.

14:50 <Schism> Mm.  Something going on with your sinuses possibly?

14:51 <Cepheid> 'S what it feels like.  Minimal pain, but among other things, my stomach wants to come up, it feels like I have a cat standing on my face, and my nose feels like it is about to explode.

14:52 <Cepheid> I'm trying the age-old solution of "hydration" to see if that helps.

14:52 <Schism> As opposed to when you actually have a cat sitting on your face.  I guess the weather bouncing back and forth (why is the ground covered in SNOW?!) doesn't help one bit.  And aye, that's a good choice.

14:53 <Cepheid> You know what I find really, really odd about all these symptoms?

14:54 <Cepheid> So, I wake up.  I feel fine.  For about three hours, my vision is nice and sharp.  Then the symptoms kick in, slowly building.  My vision begins to blur.  I can't focus my eyes for some reason.  Then, as my day begins to end about 8 hours later, my vision begins to sharpen again.

14:55 <Cepheid> It's almost like my eyeballs are being distorted or something.

14:55 <Schism> That does track with sinuses, like there's fluid buildup or something?

14:56 <Cepheid> The only indication of any sort of fluid buildup is when I rub my eyes.  Not because of drainage, mind.

14:57 <Cepheid> To start, all problems are on the left side of my face.  Left eye, left side of my nose, and left eyebrow.

14:59 <Cepheid> The pain is always in and around the left eye.  Dull burning/throbbing around the eye, sharp and searing in the eye.  Tapping or putting pressure on the eyebrow and nose induces pain.  This is why I know it's not a tension headache.  Right eye and right side of the face are always fine.

15:00 <Cepheid> So I can tell differences between the left and right eye.  Because the right eye for all intents and purposes is fine.  Anyhoo..

15:00 <Schism> Hmm.  Wish you could get in to see an ENT at this point.

15:00 <Cepheid> If I rub the right eye, everything feels and sounds fine.

15:01 <Cepheid> Which is to say, it doesn't make any noises, doesn't feel like there is fluid moving around, etc.

15:01 <Schism> Very weird to be so localized.

15:01 <Cepheid> Meanwhile, when everything is happening on the left eye, if I rub it?  I hear fluid squeaking around.  Loudly.

15:05 <Cepheid> As for seeing an ENT for this.  I have.  For over five years.  Repeatedly.  He is the best ENT in the city.  There is no one better than him in this city.

15:05 <Cepheid> He insists that my sinuses look fine.  That there is nothing wrong with them.

15:06 <Cepheid> No sign of infection.  No swelling.  No polyps.  Just minor bits of scarring from nosebleeds.

15:07 <Cepheid> He even showed me directly via camera up my nose.

15:08 <Schism> Really, really strange... and urgh.  Maybe see if you can see an opthalmologist about it?  

15:09 <Cepheid> The only other type of headache I am aware of right now that causes all of the symptoms I'm describing are cluster headaches.  So right now, I'd rather go investigate in that direction first.

15:10 <Cepheid> Especially since cluster headaches themselves can cause sinus and nasal congestion.

15:11 * Schism nods.

15:13 * Cepheid noms on cheese and triscuits. No salami, alas.

15:14 <Schism> You should see if you can find some Noah Martin's summer sausage up there.

15:15 <Schism> Aahahahahaha.  If only all politicians would be able to cut the knot like this.  http://www.waywardmartian.com/harbourmaster3/021-016.html

15:16 <Schism> Best public speech ever.  XD

15:16 <Cepheid> Heh.  I'll look into it.  Meanwhile...  *tries paper-towel dried pickled hot peppers with the cheese*

15:17 <Schism> Not a bad combination.  o3o  A bit of acidity to go with the cheese.

15:17 <Cepheid> Interesting mix.  Not bad.

15:18 <Cepheid> I find the brine overpowers the cheese, though.

15:19 <Schism> You could rinse the peppers before patting them dry.

15:19 <Schism> Or try a sharper cheese.

15:20 <Cepheid> Easier said than done, the cheese.  My parents dislike sharp cheese.

15:20 <Schism> Ah.

15:21 <Cepheid> And they have a habit of buying large blocks of cheese, so often if they buy cheese just for me, I don't eat it fast enough.

15:22 * Cepheid follows up with green grapes. o3o

15:22 <Cepheid> Oh, fun news.  I lost 5 more pounds of weight.

15:22 <Schism> I would suggest cutting it into smaller blocks and freezing them to pull out at various times.  This makes the cheese crumbly and detracts from the flavour somewhat, but it's better than seeing it grow spores.

15:23 <Cepheid> Keep up the weight loss from eating better, I'll be down to 190 in a few more months.

15:24 <Schism> Nice.  o3o

15:25 <Cepheid> Either new people moving in outside...  Or someone is having something large delivered.  Can't tell.

15:27 * Cepheid is a bit scatterbrained right now. High mental energy. Doesn't want to game though, and coding is out for the day. Just sitting, reading, and doing laundry seems to be the desire of the day.

15:29 <Cepheid> Of note though is that I am feeling better now that I've got a mix of foods and fluids in me.

15:30 <Schism> Food does cure a wide variety of ills, yes.  *sagenod*

15:30 <Cepheid> Vision even seems to be doing better.

15:30 <Schism> Hah.  "Built things are simple."  http://www.waywardmartian.com/harbourmaster4/025-003.html

15:31 * Finwe returneth home.

15:31 <Finwe> Messrs Cepheid and Schism.

15:31 * Finwe doffs his hat.

15:31 <Cepheid> Finwe.

15:31 <Schism> rAdm. Finwe.

15:31 * Schism doffs his salmon and rice with brussels sprouts.

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15:33 <Cepheid> A constant craving food-wise as of late has been anything with meat in it.

15:33 <Cepheid> Or protein.

15:33 <Schism> Could make red beans and rice.

15:33 <Schism> Simple enough, and it provides a complete protein.

15:33 <Cepheid> No red beans.  Got chickpeas though.  Could just open up the can and eat 'em straight.  Tempting, in fact.

15:34 <Schism> Got any sesame paste?

15:34 <Cepheid> Nope.

15:34 <Schism> Might want to ask if your folks could grab some.  Wash the chickpeas, grind them up with sesame paste, olive oil, and lemon juice, and you've got a basic hummus.  Add some spicy peppers too.

15:35 * Cepheid goes to get laptop to better type with.

15:37 <Cepheid> The thing that annoys me about food, recipes in particular, is that everything is extremely complex.  Multiple ingredients, more than legitimately is necessary to enjoy something, and lots of prep time.

15:38 <Cepheid> If I say I have a can of chickpeas, and I'm willing to open a can to eat them, then I want chickpeas, in the form they come in.  If I want any flavour or additions, it'd be simple flavourings.

15:38 <Cepheid> I don't need to make a hummus out of it.  I don't need to go and cook up fritters.  Or make a salad.  Or anything like that.

15:38 <Schism> Fair enough.  And there's nothing wrong with that.  Sorry, I just like hummus more than basic chickpeas, or even a chickpea salad -- it's just a personal taste.

15:38 <Cepheid> Just chickpeas.  JUST. CHICKPEAS. :P

15:38 <Schism> Fine.  :P  Just chickpeas, then.  And those are a good protein

15:38 <Schism> .

15:39 <Cepheid> It's just like, I'm looking at recipes involving chickpeas.  Chickpea curry.  Curry and fish.  It's like...  Can't you show me how to make something simple with like, 1 or 2 extra ingredients besides the chickpeas, which doesn't involve preheating an oven, etc.

15:40 <Schism> I mean... I kinda thought that was what hummus is.  Throw tahini, chickpeas, oil and lemon into blender with a little salt, pulse until smooth, serve.

15:40 <Finwe> Curry is more or less crushed tomatoes, chikpeas and spices.

15:40 <Cepheid> Okay, fair enough.

15:40 <Finwe> Prepared in a kettle.

15:40 <Schism> Or slow cooker.

15:41 * Finwe nodnods.

15:42 <Schism> Could always just have the chickpeas, oil, salt and lemon juice.  It'll still make a chickpea paste you can more readily serve on crackers.

15:42 <Cepheid> That's an idea, yeah.  Any particular oil?

15:43 <Schism> I'd just use olive oil for that bit of flavour.

15:43 <Finwe> Indeed.

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15:44 <Cepheid> Arguably, I suspect a lot of my problem with complex dishes is that A)  I'm lazy, and B)  The more complex the dish, the less benefit flavour-wise, I find.  I blame my sense of taste.

15:44 <Schism> There are those diminishing returns, aye.  I'm something of a gourmand, though I'll appreciate, say, a filet mignon with a bleu cheese crust.

15:44 <Cepheid> My sense of taste is pretty bland.  I can't taste the difference between a lot of things people swear up and down have different tastes.

15:47 <Cepheid> For some reason, I just can't taste the minute differences of things.  All spirits taste the same to me, for example.  What changes is how it burns going down.  Beer's in much the same shape, for me.  The distinctions between lemons and limes is minimal.  All types of oranges, outside of blood oranges, taste the same to me.

15:47 <Cepheid> Cheeses, there's not much difference.  Just texture, mostly.  Only standouts are Swiss/Emmental and Blue Cheese.

15:48 <Schism> And the colour of the blood orange might be resulting in a psychosomatic difference in flavour.

15:48 <Schism> You might like gruyere, if you've not tried it.  It's a much more pungent melting cheese, though its flavour profile is rather akin to Swiss.

15:49 <Cepheid> Hum, I'll have to give it a try for a macaroni and cheese then, if it's a good melting cheese.

15:49 <Cepheid> For that though, I need to learn to make a proper roux sauce though.

15:50 <Finwe> Gruyere is a Swiss cheese.

15:50 <Schism> Yes, though it's different from what we see as regular Swiss over on this side of the pond.

15:50 <Cepheid> Mmhmm.

15:50 <Finwe> Gruyère, to be exact.

15:50 <Cepheid> It annoys me when you're that pedantic. :P

15:51 <Finwe> It's also produced in France, but Gruyère is located in Fribourg in Switzerland.

15:51 <Schism> Cepheid: That's really, really easy.  Take equal parts butter and flour by weight.  Melt butter, add flour gradually, stirring constantly.  Cook on low-medium heat until it browns to your satisfaction: the whiter the roux, the more pronounced its thickening properties, but darker rouxs will impart a nutty flavour (and taste less like uncooked flour).

15:52 *** Joins: AppleDash (appled@Gladiolus.Rocks)

15:52 <Cepheid> Ah.  Is margarine a suitable replacement for butter, though?

15:52 <Schism> Yeah, that'll work too.

15:52 <Schism> Mostly it's the oils you want -- a traditional roux uses lard.

15:54 <Cepheid> Ah.

15:54 <Schism> What you'll come up with is a kind of paste.  The reason the darker roux has less thickening properties is because the starches unbind the longer they're subjected to heat.

15:55 *** Joins: RyuImperator (RyuImperato@Pony-o527to.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)

15:56 <Finwe> That paste is roux, innit?

15:56 <Schism> Yup.

15:57 <Finwe> The sauce is called béchamel in French cuisine.

15:57 <Schism> From there, you add other ingredients gradually to the roux, which creates the actual sauce.  For your standard white sauce, you just need to add milk or cream, again gradually.

15:58 <Finwe> The other four basic sauces being hollandaise, espagnole, velouté and tomato sauce.

15:59 <Schism> Tomato sauce is a bit different, as it frequently doesn't require a thickening agent.

15:59 <Schism> Hollandaise is... much more complicated, and I wouldn't get into that as a first-time sauce.

16:00 <Finwe> It's not that difficult.

16:00 <Schism> Well, not complicated in ingredient terms, it's just a few steps up from a simple roux-based sauce.

16:00 <Finwe> You just need clarified butter, egg yolks and a reduction of white wine vinegar.

16:00 <Schism> Or lemon juice.  o3o

16:01 <Finwe> And lemon juice.

16:01 <Schism> Yes, and/or.

16:02 <Finwe> Swap the spices and you have bearnaise.

16:02 <Schism> Now, that one does need white wine vinegar.

16:04 <Schism> Anyway, for the Bechemel sauce for the macaroni and cheese (yes, I know, Finwe, but our keyboards don't have accents readily available), you'd just make your standard white sauce with cheeses added. Cook the macaroni, stir it in with the cheese sauce, toss it into a casserole dish, top it with breadcrumbs and bacon, cover the dish in tinfoil and bake at... mmm, 350?  For however long you prefer.

16:05 <Schism> Ideally enough for the bottom to be browned so you can enjoy the crunchy bits.

16:05 <Finwe> A bit like our macaroni casserole.

16:06 <Schism> That is roughly the same, yes.

16:06 <Schism> Of course, you can just throw the sauce and the macaroni together and enjoy it that way.

16:06 <Schism> Cepheid: Heh, sorry about the wave of information.  I kind of like cooking.  :S

16:07 <Schism> On Food and Cooking has a permanent place in my library.

16:07 <Cepheid> It's fine.  I got distracted a bit anyways. :P

16:07 <Finwe> https://res.cloudinary.com/hufennija/image/upload/f_auto,q_50,fl_progressive,w_790,h_460,c_fill/1465630.jpg

16:07 <Schism> Yup, tha'ts just what we're looking at, just in a different bowl.  o3o

16:07 * Filly_Nightmares yawnskrees and then sneezies at Schism

16:07 <Schism> that's*

16:07 * Filly_Nightmares sleepy floof

16:08 * Schism yawwwwnies, and provides Filly_Nightmares wif some baked macaroni!

16:08 * Filly_Nightmares purrs happily and nibbles

16:08 <Finwe> It's baked in oven, with pre-boiled macaroni, minced meat and a mixture of milk and eggs, and with cheese on the top.

16:08 * Schism nodnods. "Not quite the same, but we have something like that over here too. Really, though, macaroni casseroles are widespread and vary greatly based on personal recipes."

16:09 <Finwe> Eeeyup.

16:09 <Schism> I personally like bacon more than ground beef or mincemeat when it comes to macaroni and cheese.

16:10 <Schism> Also, I know I've said it before, but if you've not yet: Cepheid, Finwe, you must read On Food and Cooking if you've yet to do so.

16:10 <Finwe> Schism: By Harold McGee?

16:11 <Schism> Yup, that's the one.

16:11 <Finwe> http://wtf.tw/ref/mcgee.pdf

16:12 <Schism> This is indeed the book in question.

16:13 <Finwe> Human milk seems to have relatively low protein content.

16:13 <Schism> I have a hard copy which I picked up back when I worked for a bookstore, and I've never once regretted it.  Also, hah.

16:13 <Finwe> But it is quite high on lactose.

16:14 <Finwe> Fin whale milk consists 42% of fat.

16:14 <Finwe> And 12% of protein.

16:14 <Schism> I've praised the book as one in which you can open to any page and learn something.

16:17 <Finwe> Any of the about 900 pages. o3o

16:18 <Schism> It's a scientific encyclopedia of food.  Of course it's going to be a long read!

16:20 <Finwe> "The modern decline of cheesemaking has its roots in that same golden age. Cheese and butter factories were born in the United States, a country with no cheesemaking tradition, just 70 years after the Revolution."

16:21 <Schism> The mass-produced cheeses and butters, certainly.

16:22 <Schism> Homogeniety has its ups and downs.

16:23 <Finwe> McGee then goes on to mention process cheese.

16:23 <Schism> Of course.  Which is, ultimately, a sauce poured into a mold rather than an actual cheese.

16:26 <Schism> Finwe: One trick which Harold McGee discovered too late to add into the revised edition of this tome is the trick by which you, too, can make sodium carbonate.

16:27 <Schism> As this is a semi-living document, I would expect another revision to be published in a couple years.

16:28 <Cepheid> ... Good [REDACTED] heavens.  An anti-lockdown protester showed up at a Subway with, of all things, a ROCKET LAUNCHER.  It had a label on it that read "inert", but still.

16:29 <Schism> Okay, I wish I could drag that person out into the street and go all R. Lee Ermey on them.

16:30 <Schism> Even if the providers diked out all the explosive material possible, that's still not what you do with a goddamned rocket launcher.

16:30 <Schism> Excuse my French.

16:31 <Cepheid> I swear these protesters are trying to get themselves killed, because showing up at places armed to the teeth is a good way to get yourself killed, even in the US.

16:31 <Finwe> Schism: Je t'excuse.

16:31 <Schism> There, ah, is one caveat which I believe must be stated.

16:31 <Schism> They're all white.

16:32 <Schism> Which turns them from 'hate group/terrorist faction' into 'freedom fighters'.

16:32 <ADragonDreaming> Also, the DeVos organization is behind the astroturf operations.

16:32 <ADragonDreaming> That said, I refer to them as terrorists.

16:33 <Cepheid> A white person will still shoot a white person if they feel their lives are threatened.  And given that there are people both on the far extreme ends of the debate, who are just as crazy about protesting with or without guns...

16:33 <Schism> I AM AMAZED BY THIS NEWS.  I wonder if the left hand knows what the right is doing.

16:33 <ADragonDreaming> And I refer to the DeVos organization as terrorist organizers.

16:33 <Schism> As you well should, Adra.

16:33 <ADragonDreaming> Yes, I would love to show up at one of these protests with a tank. Devoid of ammunition, mind.

16:34 <ADragonDreaming> Just ... slowly rolling forward.

16:34 <Schism> I'm just chuckling darkly because the DeVoses are hand in glove with the Waltons, who have shown a rather surprising amount of responsibility in handling things.

16:35 <Schism> At least, on the surface.

16:35 <Schism> Adra: I wouldn't mind riding shotgun, if you'll excuse the phrase.

16:35 <Cepheid> I call the main cannon.

16:36 <Cepheid> I'll just emit loud "BOOM!" sound effects.

16:36 <Schism> Not actual explosions, just a guy shouting "Boom!"?

16:36 <Cepheid> Yes.

16:36 <Cepheid> It's unarmed.  No ammo.

16:36 <Schism> Well, sound effects and all.

16:36 <Cepheid> I'd have to settle for like, trying to fire squirrels out of it somehow, scavenged from the surroundings.

16:36 <Schism> You might wind up with a public nuisance charge, though.  Think we can do that in Alberta?

16:37 <Cepheid> I'd use cats, but I don't want to hurt them.

16:37 <Cepheid> Or have them get sick from attacking the protesters.

16:38 <Schism> I'm now imagining a road trip where we just drive down the highway in a tank, pleasantly following traffic laws and apologize to anyone we inconvenience on our way.

16:38 <Schism> apologizing*

16:38 <Cepheid> We'd get pulled over by the cops.  It's a military-style weapon, illegal now.

16:38 <Finwe> If you filled herrings with magnetic material, you could use a Gauss gun to fire them.

16:38 <Cepheid> And because we're Canadian, we'd oblige the officers and actually pull over.

16:38 <Schism> I know, though I suspect that once we explain our mission we'll get a cordon of like-minded folks.

16:39 <Cepheid> As for poking the hornets nest that is Alberta, let's not.  It's... in it's own little fragile mental space right now.

16:39 <Cepheid> Between oil no longer being lucrative enough for them, the lockdown must be driving them up a wall.  They're a little too dangerous to approach right now.

16:40 <Cepheid> It's probably safer to go to Quebec right now and kiss random people than it is to go to Alberta.

16:40 <Schism> Has been for decades.  There's a reason the judge in Meads vs. Meads who wrote that magnificent 300-page document was in Alberta.

16:41 <Schism> Er, 200-page.  Still a good, long read.

16:41 <Cepheid> It's gotten worse as of the last few years though.

16:41 <Cepheid> I know Quebec has made a lot of demands of the Federal government, but given the media coverage, it seems more like Alberta's worse than Quebec now in that regard.

16:41 <Schism> Yeah... these things do.

16:43 <Schism> Quebec, I can somewhat understand.  The French-Canadian folks feeling that they're ostracized and diminished by the rest of the country, that makes sense, and seeking to break away from all that via parliamentary procedures is at least, if not totally sane, then at least a good bit better than what we're seeing there.

16:43 <Cepheid> My observation of Alberta these last few years suggests that Alberta hinged so much on oil, that it never planned, or considered that the oil industry might crash for one reason or another.

16:43 <Cepheid> And as such, now that it's in a bad spot, it has NO IDEA WHAT TO DO.

16:43 <Schism> Now here's your fun fact for the day: it did.  They just didn't expect it to happen again.

16:44 <Cepheid> For those not following, Alberta right now, is, take Texas, have oil become utterly worthless.  That's Alberta.

16:44 <Cepheid> It is losing it *YAY* because oil went downhill for it a few years back, for various reasons.

16:44 <Schism> Further, Alberta is primarily rural, and many of the farmers therein are having issues too.

16:44 <Cepheid> And wants the government to basically bail it out.

16:45 <Cepheid> Rather than try to resolve the issue through other means.

16:45 <Cepheid> And now it's in an even worse position.

16:45 <Cepheid> Given the crash of oil a few weeks ago.

16:46 <Schism> Just in case you folks in the US thought Canada was a great place to escape everything, sorry, but we're almost as screwed up.

16:46 <Cepheid> And the obstruction of the pipeline *AGAIN*.

16:46 <Cepheid> We have our own problems.

16:48 <Cepheid> Quebec's concerned about it's cultural identity.  Train logistics is being hammered by protests from native groups, and as a result, farmers out in the prairies are having problems with food shipments.  Alberta's lost it's mind because it hinged so much on oil never failing that when it actually failed, it had no idea what to do, and still doesn't.

16:48 <Cepheid> British Columbia, fires everywhere, seal clubbing.

16:49 <Schism> Ontario's alright, except that we have Doug Ford, who's managed to evade all his awful by being right on exactly one thing.

16:49 <Cepheid> Ontario, got a bunch of morons for provincial government and federal government, also scandals out the wazoo.

16:49 <Schism> And that.

16:49 <Cepheid> If anything, the least I hear about is everything past Quebec out to the East.

16:49 <Schism> I guess I haven't heard too much out of Nova Scotia.  

16:50 <Cepheid> Even up north, in Nunavut, things are relatively quiet, and I'm not sure if that's just because there's nothing going on, or because there's no one up there reporting things.  Based on what I've heard from my sister, it sounds more like the latter.

16:50 <Cepheid> Since she's the closest source of information on what it's like to live in a native community.

16:50 <Cepheid> And it's not good.

16:50 <Schism> Or Saskatchewan.  I guess those folks are... well, from what I'm given to understand, NS and Saskatchewan folks are kind of in a permanent state of 'don't give a buck, we'll muddle on through.'

16:51 <Finwe> Nieuw-Schotland

16:51 <Schism> That works.

16:51 <Cepheid> Given Newfoundland and it's interesting dialect of English..

16:53 <Schism> Cepheid: Nunavut is... an interesting case.  From what I'm given to understand, community gatherings are a central aspect.

16:53 <Schism> This means bad things during a pandemic.

16:54 *** Joins: Angeline (Scootaloo@I.Will.Fly.Higher)

16:57 <Finwe> Oh, "Nieuw-Schotland" is Dutch.

16:58 <Schism> Its meaning shines through, though.  :P

16:59 <Cepheid> Surprisingly, the only incident was a false positive where my sister lives.

17:00 <Schism> That's not too bad.  The problem is that with how close-knit said communities tend to be, if one person gets it, so will almost everyone else.

17:00 <Schism> Still heart-attack inducing, tho.

17:00 <Cepheid> It certainly upset my mother, yes.

17:07 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Makenshi: Autumn Blaze Music: Cynifree & Zizkil - From Here To Where (Extended Mix) [Progressive House/Complextro] [ http://tinyurl.com/yabt746t ]

17:19 <Cepheid> Right, tonight/tomorrow is gonna be spent on wringing out the kinks in my intersection testing code.

17:19 <Cepheid> Because there's some problems with it.

17:19 <Cepheid> And after that, fixing up entity position updates, because that's broken too.

17:20 <Schism> It sounds like you might want to fix the latter before the former.

17:20 <Cepheid> Latter relies upon the former, unfortunately.

17:20 <Cepheid> And I know the former's broken.

17:20 <Schism> Ah, a snarl.  Fair nuff.

17:21 <Cepheid> Meanwhile, it'd be a good time to start implementing some more debug functionality.

17:27 <Cepheid> Though to be honest it looks closer to the latter system being broken.

17:28 <Schism> That's ... kind of what I was thinking.  If it can't properly report the status of mobiles, then it'll result in intersections.

17:30 <Cepheid> ... Yeah, it's the latter system.

17:30 <Cepheid> The intersection tests are correct, it's something in the update function that's broken.

17:32 <Schism> Probably reliant upon something further up the tree which only updates things irregularly.

17:34 <Cepheid> Hmm.  It was that change that introduced that bug.  Okay then, so that means the entire update phase needs to be rewritten to account for the new feature because it no longer works for what I need.

17:35 <Schism> At least you know where the issue is now.  That's half the trouble.

17:37 <Cepheid> Physics is literally the worst part of gamedev.

17:39 <Schism> A subset of physics, anyway.  Interaction between objects... augh.

17:39 <Cepheid> And the worst part is, this is interactions between entities and the world.  The static part of the physics.

17:40 <Cepheid> Left and right motion, that's easy.  Downwards motion, that too is easy.

17:40 <Cepheid> The complexity I have here is in regards to UPWARDS motion.

17:40 <Schism> 10 m/sec^2 is always rough to translate, if you even want to work with that.

17:41 <Cepheid> Let me rephrase where the problem is.  It's in resolving intersections.

17:41 <Schism> An initial impetus followed by a decent - yeah.

17:41 <Schism> descent*

17:41 <Cepheid> That is, when an object touches another object, how to resolve the collision.

17:41 <Cepheid> In this case, resolving the intersection of an entity moving left or right, but encountering an upwards slope.

17:43 <Schism> Well, each should ideally impart an impetus onto the other.  For the slope, you'd want to probably provide a counter based on gravity and the slope... but then leaping off said slope would involve its own sort of thing.

17:43 <Cepheid> It's easy to handle cases where objects go downwards.  Because there's no need to check if the entity can go down a slope.  Anything can move down a slope.

17:44 *** Quits: ryaxnb21 (ryaxnb@Pony-hj0ath.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)

17:44 <Schism> If a mobile is moving down a slope, there's no reason to impart upward momentum when they jump off.

17:44 <Cepheid> Hmm.

17:45 <Schism> Outside the normal upwards momentum from jumping.

17:45 <Schism> Horizontal, sure.

17:45 <Schism> But that's more of a function of their horizontal momentum anyway.

17:47 <Cepheid> I'm not concerned about stuff like momentum and the like.

17:47 <Schism> Hm.. oh, I see.

17:47 <Cepheid> This is more in, where do I place the entity when an intersection occurs?  In an upward slope, obviously you want to push the entity up a pixel or two.

17:47 <Cepheid> And then retest to make sure that the new position is valid.  If not, revert the positional change, and just stop horizontal movement altogether.

17:48 <Cepheid> The current system is not designed to handle this.

17:48 *** Joins: ryaxnb21 (ryaxnb@Pony-hj0ath.ca.comcast.net)

17:48 <Cepheid> The current system is...  It was not designed with upwards slopes in mind.

17:48 <Schism> And you certainly don't want to take La*Mulana's route.

17:49 *** Quits: RyuImperator (RyuImperato@Pony-o527to.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: Leaving.)

17:49 * Cepheid coughs. >.>;

17:49 *** Quits: Angeline (Scootaloo@I.Will.Fly.Higher) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)

17:49 <Cepheid> I know what needs to be done now, though.

17:49 <Schism> I MEANT the bug which causes players to appear back on the surface when they don't jump right and get trapped in a wall.

17:49 <Cepheid> Our discussion clued me in a bit.

17:49 <Cepheid> Oh, that.

17:49 <Cepheid> That can't happen with this system.

17:50 <Schism> Well, I'm glad I could help.

17:50 <Schism> And oh?

17:50 <Schism> Also, Cepheid, I has an idea.

17:52 <Schism> Vertical shaft which leads the next player to their objective, after which they can turn off the defenses and use it as an elevator to lead from point to point.  First run through, they have to deal with enemies as well as wall crushers, though they can get back onto the chain if they fall off.

17:53 <Schism> A classic, as they say.

17:53 *** Joins: RyuImperator (RyuImperato@Pony-o527to.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)

17:54 <Cepheid> I don't know how LM does it, but it's not using what I'm using.  Basically, when an entity moves from point A to point B in one game world step, the system steps along the path between point A and point B, one pixel at a time separately along each axis, doing a horizontal pixel change first, then a vertical change.  After each pixel position change, it does an intersection test.  If the test fails, the pixel change is reverted.

17:54 *** Quits: RyuImperator (RyuImperato@Pony-o527to.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: Leaving.)

17:54 <Cepheid> As a result, it is virtually impossible to end up with an entity inside of a solid object from moving.  Any attempt for this to happen would result in the entity simply staying where it was.

17:55 <Cepheid> It doesn't matter how fast it was going, either.

17:56 <Cepheid> However, modifications to this setup are going to be needed.

17:56 <Schism> Someone'll eventually find a way to break that, but that does sound solid.  Do you have a case for when it eventually fails yet?

17:57 <Schism> Like putting the player in a room full of kittens.

17:57 <Cepheid> Presumably, spawning an entity inside of a solid object would break the system, sort of.

17:57 <Cepheid> It wouldn't be able to move.

17:57 <Schism> That works.  Just shunt them 10 blocks down and leave 'em.

17:58 <Schism> Probably want to have a message about it, though.

17:58 <Cepheid> A debug warning, yeah.

17:58 <Cepheid> A simpler approach would be to check see if the entity can even be spawned in the location.  If it can't, simply don't spawn it.  It'd be more apparent of a problem.

17:59 *** Joins: RyuImperator (RyuImperato@Pony-o527to.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)

17:59 <Cepheid> An entity that's shunted is less noticeable than an entity that simply isn't there.

18:00 <Schism> Fair nuff.  Let the player know that it's a beta and we're clearing up that bug, thank you for your input.

18:00 <Schism> Tho you'd need to let them know ahead of time that you're gathering debug info.

18:00 <Cepheid> Of course.

18:01 <Cepheid> Arguably though..

18:01 <Cepheid> The ultimate way to identify a bugged entity/enemy in that manner?

18:01 *** Quits: WildSoft (WildSoft@Pony-ca7vt3.bredband.comhem.se) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)

18:01 <Cepheid> Spawn it, don't shunt it, and let it be stuck in place.

18:01 <Cepheid> Possibly with highlighting to indicate there's a problem with it, during beta testing.

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18:03 <Schism> Fair enough.  I was just thinking that if a player gets shunted, there's something demonstrably wrong.

18:03 <Schism> Might be a heisenbug, tho.  :<

18:03 <Cepheid> The player getting shunted or stuck from spawning inside the wall is a real problem, yeah.

18:04 <Cepheid> Especially since the only way that'd ever happen is through transitions.

18:04 <Cepheid> And that's less spawning, and more forcing the player to an invalid position through standard logic.

18:04 <Schism> Cepheid.

18:04 <Schism> You and I both know that's not the only way.  :P

18:04 <Cepheid> Yes, yes.

18:04 <Cepheid> In any case, I'm done coding for the day, for reals this time.

18:05 <Schism> But yeah, fair nuff.  Read that book Finwe linked, it's about cooking in a manner I think you'd appreciate.

18:05 <Cepheid> I'll read it later.  I'm more interested in SCP right now.  I'm gonna go get cleaned up, take my seroquel, and lay down and read me some scips, methinks.

18:06 <Schism> Or we can do more dungeons -- or that!

18:06 <Cepheid> It's technically time for me to get into bed.  My day is usually about 16 hours.  At around 14 hours, I tend to lay down and read.

18:06 <Cepheid> It's currently hour 14.

18:07 <Schism> What works, works. Your day is an odd variant, but I've done the same, and I'm going to have to readjust soon.

18:07 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Flower Pony Day May 17th! Go Draw the Flower Ponies!  [ http://tinyurl.com/ybzcr7un ]

18:08 <Schism> You might also like that webcomic I mentioned.  I'm enjoying it.

18:09 <Finwe> Schism: I shall. It's just something that is not easily done in one evening.

18:10 <Schism> This is true.  14 years of webcomic is hard to enjoy in one siting, under most circumstances.

18:10 <Finwe> And 900 pages of culiunarism.

18:10 <Cepheid> It's more that my day is 16 hours because that's how my circadian rhythm seems to be set up.  Unless I did not get enough sleep, I am generally incapable of sleeping any sooner than 14-16 after waking up.

18:11 <Schism> Oh, that too.  X3

18:11 <Cepheid> And it is this, combined with my general sleeping time of 8-10 hours, that results in my cycle slowly moving forward all the time.

18:21 <Cepheid> That all said, I'm thinking tonight when I wake up, and for the duration of my day tomorrow, I may actually just play FF14.  I was SUPPOSED to stop taking my vyvanse over the weekend to relax, but I didn't do that.

18:21 <Cepheid> And my brain, well, it could use a bit of a slap upside it's face.

18:23 <Schism> I fear I won't be of much assistance there.  Unless I sleep now, then I'll be working all through the next long while.

18:23 <Schism> Not much sense to be had.

18:24 <Cepheid> https://i.redd.it/0nc6k4inn5y41.gif

18:24 <Cepheid> Well, if I'm on, and you are available at some point when I'm on, I'm up for some dungeons.  May even have a few more story ones unlocked to do.

18:25 <Schism> I do suggest them.  If you'd like to try at least one more trial, then we do have the finale of the Hildibrand quest to do.

18:26 <Schism> And the MSQ does have one more trial for you if memory serves.  The ultimate finale of Stormblood.

18:26 <Cepheid> There is that too.

18:26 <Cepheid> https://v.redd.it/ubimm99245y41

18:26 <Schism> Also, not sure if you ever did the FF Tactics crossover.

18:27 <Cepheid> I did not.

18:27 <Schism> Those are the alliance raids.  The Shadowbringers ones are a crossover with NieR, but Stormblood are FFT.

18:28 <Cepheid> I am aware, yeah.

18:29 <Schism> Until the FFT raids, I didn't know that some people have difficulty multiplying the number 3.

18:29 <Cepheid> 3 6 9 12 15 18 21 24 27 30.  Not hard.

18:29 <Schism> And those are provided ahead of time.

18:30 <Schism> Prime numbers are a bit trickier, but it's just 2 3 5 7 11 13 17.

18:30 <Cepheid> https://v.redd.it/spr1dapfm0y41

18:33 <Cepheid> Yep.  Gonna take tomorrow off.  Especially since I'd like to design this new position update system more carefully before implementation.

18:34 * Schism nodnods.

18:46 *** Quits: RyuImperator (RyuImperato@Pony-o527to.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: Leaving.)

18:47 <Cepheid> Does the black moon howl?

18:47 <Schism> Only when the sun is dark.  <O5-level restrictions unlocked.>

18:51 <Cepheid> Heh.

18:56 <Schism> Oh, regarding that pataphysical SCP, the password is straightforward -- if you read the other stories.

18:57 <Schism> The antimemetics one.

18:59 <Schism> You should know this one by now.  http://www.scp-wiki.net/scp-3125

19:00 <Schism> And in case you don't -- what's 3125?

19:01 <Finwe> o3o

19:01 *** Joins: Angeline (Scootaloo@I.Will.Fly.Higher)

19:02 * Finwe hats on Angeline.

19:07 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Ghostbusters "Plasmane" Now Listed on Amazon UK  [ http://tinyurl.com/y95hueyk ]

19:15 <Cepheid> I don't know what 3125 is, and I'm half-sedated, not in a position to play an ARG.

19:22 <Schism> What are the prime factors of 3125?

19:25 <Schism> That should be all you need to know to read that SCP page.  o3o

19:28 * Schism attempts to tell Cepheid about SCP-55, but it doesn't exist.

19:28 <Schism> SCP-055*

19:31 <Cepheid> How are you supposed to figure out the prime factorization thing?

19:33 <Schism> 3125?  It's 5^5.  And then qntm's stories about it are named "Five five five five five".  It's kind of a running theme.

19:33 *** Joins: RichardMist (User@tor.sasl.RichardMist)

19:33 <Schism> It's really really obvious immediately after you realize it.  And not a moment before.

19:34 <Cepheid> Ah.  Hum.  Sounds like it describes memes.

19:34 <Schism> Yuuuuup.

19:34 <RichardMist> hoiii everyponies! *waves*

19:35 <Schism> Though I also have this thing where when I see a number in an ARG, I immediately wonder if it's a multiplication of primes and delve into factorials.

19:35 <Schism> And not just ARGs, but regular stories.

19:35 <Schism> Every time I see the number 108 I twitch.

19:39 *** Quits: RichardMist (User@tor.sasl.RichardMist) (The TLS connection was non-properly terminated.)

19:39 *** Joins: RichardMist (User@tor.sasl.RichardMist)

19:42 <Cepheid> Heh.  I deal in different kinds of numbers, myself.  Powers of 2 or 16 are more apparent to me.

19:43 <Schism> Oh, same here, but prime numbers hold a different place in my heart.

19:44 <Schism> I also played way too much MYST, and so powers of five are kind of right here.

19:45 <Schism> 108 is, of course, 1^1*2^2*3^3, so that sticks in the brain.

19:46 <Cepheid> http://www.scp-wiki.net/scp-4122

19:47 <Schism> This implies that 4122 has a basis upon Earth, an anchoring point.  Otherwise objects would appear in space.

19:48 <Schism> Or is the anchoring point.

19:53 <Cepheid> Probably.  I just like it due to the audio logs.

20:03 *** Quits: RichardMist (User@tor.sasl.RichardMist) (The TLS connection was non-properly terminated.)

20:03 *** Joins: RichardMist (User@tor.sasl.RichardMist)

21:07 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Twitaro vs Stardio - JoJo's Bizaare Adventure Parody  [ http://tinyurl.com/y9x3a523 ]

22:07 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Drawfriend Stuff (Pony Art Gallery) #3339 [ http://tinyurl.com/y9tqdxjw ]

22:10 <Schism> "Wow." "Um.  I'm so sorry that this has--" "Oh, nonono, don't be.  The adrenaline shot is seriously what I needed, and someone trying to kill me is a really good way to get that.  I just want him to wake up soon so he can answer why."

22:11 <Schism> "You're... not mad?" "I expected someone to go for my throat sooner than this." "Okay, I take it back, you are mad."

22:15 <Schism> "If he doesn't have a very good reason, though, I reserve the right to take one swift shot at his junk." "We'll save that for later." "Thank you."

22:17 *** Quits: RichardMist (User@tor.sasl.RichardMist) (Connection closed)

22:17 *** Joins: RichardMist (User@tor.sasl.RichardMist)

22:35 *** Joins: luckyspirit (luckyspirit@pony.poni.pony)

22:38 *** Joins: Pony|46982 (Pony46982@Pony-i454b4.cable.virginm.net)

22:49 *** Quits: luckyspirit (luckyspirit@pony.poni.pony) (The TLS connection was non-properly terminated.)

22:49 *** Joins: Ali (Ali@Pony-5kpu09.4nua.5fca.1702.2600.IP)

22:49 *** ChanServ sets mode: +qo Ali Ali

23:02 <Schism> "You know, I showed him around once.  All the temptations of the Earth." "What, really?" "Well, he's a carpenter from Galilee.  His travel options were limited."

23:02 * Ali flops over the Schism

23:03 * Schism boops the Ali with a slice of strawberry-rhubarb pie with vanilla ice cream.

23:07 * Lumindia_ leans against Ali, snuggles

23:07 * Ali sends a dungeon guardian after Lumindia_~

23:08 <Lumindia_> [/me kills it, claims the pet

23:09 * Schism peers at Lumindia's new minion. It is a flying grey pegasus with a yellow pane.

23:09 <Schism> Ahem, mane.

23:10 <Lumindia_> op.o

23:10 <Lumindia_> I thought it was a tiny skeleton

23:10 * Lumindia_ hecks at Schism

23:10 * Schism supposes he'll have to run the Ali dungeon a few times in order to get that for himself.

23:11 <Ali> Well 1.4 is coming soon~

23:11 <Ali> Just beware that it will instant kill you if it touches you.

23:17 <Lumindia_> I'm aware

23:17 <Lumindia_> meanwhile, at modded terraria, where I can tank two hits from it

23:18 <Ali> Calamity?

23:18 <Ali> I'm a bit excited for 1.4, but I hope to find someone to play with

23:23 <Lumindia_> yep

23:23 <Lumindia_> calamity

23:29 <Lumindia_> https://i.imgur.com/z7g5j7P.jpg

23:29 <Lumindia_> meanwhile,

23:29 <Lumindia_> in a world in which I've completely dismantled the temple AND The underground temple

23:29 <Ali> but there is only the temple

23:29 <Ali> It only exists in the underground jungle

23:29 <Lumindia_> errr

23:29 <Lumindia_> I meant to say Underground Desert

23:29 <Lumindia_> HECK

23:30 <Lumindia_> /me hecks quietly but forcefully

23:30 <Ali> That is a lame dungeon you got there Lumindia_

23:31 <Lumindia_> well I've also torn out a good chunk of it

23:32 <Ali> Is that giant hole in the jungle what used to be the temple?

23:32 <Lumindia_> yes

23:33 <Ali> And the other jungle hole is the plantera arena?

23:33 <Lumindia_> https://i.imgur.com/yGA6nLd.png this smaller hole was, yes

23:46 <Ali> I see that large deep water on one side

23:46 <Ali> And I'm like, you digging to the bottom to dump all the water out?

23:46 <Ali> Then I remember that Calamity has a deep ocean area.

23:54 <Lumindia_> the abyss

23:54 *** Ali is now known as Ali|Nap