00:00 <Schism> No, no. My freezer is a cheap 7-bit one.
00:01 <Schism> Why they felt a need to make it a signed integer, I don't know.
00:01 <Cepheid> 128.
00:01 <Schism> And then where would I put my ice cream? :<
00:01 <ADragonDreaming> Were they sold in packs of 8?
00:01 <Schism> 32.
00:02 <ADragonDreaming> Ah.
00:02 <ADragonDreaming> So... yes.
00:02 <Schism> It's not like waffles aren't the platonic ideal of breakfast food, though.
00:03 <Ali> Says the people that drop gravy and stuff on fries
00:03 <ADragonDreaming> Serve them with chicken.
00:03 <Cepheid> So they're 6-bit waffles.
00:03 <Cepheid> No, 5-bit.
00:03 <Schism> ADragonDreaming, chicken and maple syrup.
00:03 <ADragonDreaming> 64=2^6
00:03 <Schism> Well, 32 in a pack, so 2^5.
00:04 <ADragonDreaming> Yes, but you found two.
00:04 <ADragonDreaming> *bought
00:04 <Schism> However it goes.
00:04 *** Joins: NitroTheFurry2 (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net)
00:05 <Schism> Also opened up the jar of sour cherry jam, which goes well with the waffles.
00:06 *** Quits: LibrarianofHope (Librarianof@Pony-8qu.6k1.114.201.IP) (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client)
00:07 * Cepheid takes seroquel.
00:07 <ADragonDreaming> sleep well!
00:07 *** Joins: Nitro (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net)
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00:09 *** Joins: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net)
00:10 <Schism> While today has been an interesting verse of positive, negative, and 'wut', I am pleased that a certain person's Twitter account has now been suspended, with a potential option on permanent shutdown.
00:11 <Schism> Though @jack, that barn door has been smashed into the ground by a rampaging storm of hooves, and I'm pretty sure that repairing it and closing it won't bring the horses back in.
00:11 * Ali flops over the Schism and noms
00:12 * Schism snuggles the Ali, and eees. "Doctor appointment tomorrow." She is happy, an illustration that something is very wrong with her.
00:12 <Ali> Nobody is happy to go to a doctor
00:12 <Schism> Regular person: "Oh god, I don't want to see the doctor." Trans person: "Omg omg omg finally a doctor appointment"
00:12 * Ali slams hooves on desk and points hoof at. "THerefore. SOMETHING MUST BE WRONG."
00:13 <Ali> Or..its just HRT
00:13 <Schism> Potential HRT.
00:13 <Schism> A step forward. These steps forward are few and far apart. If I can get on a t-blocker and at least _something_, I'll be happy.
00:13 * Ali bleps. "Figured it out a bit late."
00:13 <Schism> Well, happier.
00:14 * Schism places a cherry chocolate cupcake on Ali's blep.
00:14 * Ali mlems it all over Schism face.
00:15 * Schism blehs. And harrumphs. Hugs Ali again, and smears it everywhere.
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00:22 * Starlight_Glimmer distinctly remembers Ali loving to be on the receiving end of syringes
00:22 * Ali telesmacks Starlight_Glimmer
00:23 <Starlight_Glimmer> Rude!
00:24 <Ali> I hate needles and you know it
00:26 * Schism provides Ali with a plush Cactuar. It has needles! ...tiny, non-pointy, fabric needles.
00:26 * Ali boops Schism, cactus needles aren't as threatening as the medical ones... hates blood draws
00:28 *** Joins: Nedemai (Nedemai@Pony-inl.g65.158.104.IP)
00:28 <Nedemai> Please be safe everyone
00:29 * Lumindia hugs Ali tightly
00:29 * Lumindia also extends that to Ali and Schism
00:29 *** Joins: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net)
00:29 * Schism hugs the Nedemai, too.
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00:35 *** Joins: Jackie (Jarva@Pony-nb93v1.ckh7.ltq5.3c00.2404.IP)
00:36 *** Jackie is now known as Pony_22713
00:36 <Pony_22713> What pony communities still support IRC
00:37 *** Joins: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net)
00:39 <ADragonDreaming> This one
00:39 <ADragonDreaming> I dunno, this is the only pony community I've ever been in, so.
00:47 <Starlight_Glimmer> So there are "advertisements" for "emotional support Canadians" on Twitter. I approve of this concept :3
00:51 <Schism> Don't look at me, I'm not an emotional support anything.
00:58 <Starlight_Glimmer> Oh you have no idea. Good food is like half the way to victory.
00:59 * Starlight_Glimmer snuggles into Ali's side for the night, will decide which of Ali's buttocks is her favorite to administer a flu shot tomorrow.
01:00 <Ali> Jokes on you, I don't get the flu shot
01:01 <Starlight_Glimmer> Oh you will, I make sure of that.
01:01 * Starlight_Glimmer can't risk their Ali getting sick.
01:02 * Ali hasn't had the flu for almost thirty years.
01:02 <Starlight_Glimmer> In reality I'm not getting one either
01:05 <Starlight_Glimmer> Few people a actually get the real influenza. A lot don't get the difference between the flu and a common cold. Getting the real flu isn't quite as mild as a common cold. For risk groups getting a flu shot does make a lot of sense though.
01:06 <Lumindia> I had the flu last year
01:06 <Lumindia> it sucked
01:06 <Lumindia> flu symptoms hit like a truck
01:06 <Lumindia> 5 PM, I'm fine, up and about doing stuff
01:06 <Lumindia> 5:30 PM, I'm in bed, completely lacking any energy
01:07 <Lumindia> I know first hand that the flu is a good deal worse
01:16 * Finwe finishes reading Equal Rites.
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01:16 <Finwe> Let us see what we shall read next.
01:17 *** Quits: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net) (Connection closed)
01:22 <Finwe> The chronological approach dictates that Mort shall be the next one. o3o
01:23 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Calpain: Comic: Mistletoe Attack / Movie Slate: Outbreak / Journey Home 1 / Singing Storm 3 / Random Sketches 145-148 / Shiny Bits [ https://tinyurl.com/y2lzdstl ]
01:26 <Finwe> "394 pages left in this chapter"
01:27 <Finwe> Is there a single Discworld novel divided into chapters?
01:28 *** Joins: PinkieShy (coolm@Pony-ck81je.67-212-45-net.sccoast.net)
01:34 <Lumindia> lol
01:39 * Finwe hugs a PinkieShy.
01:42 <Schism> Finwe: Making Money was divided into chapters, as were some others in the Moist series.
01:44 <Finwe> True.
01:45 *** Joins: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net)
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02:08 <PinkieShy> Finally can stop sneezing 20 times a day :3
02:08 <PinkieShy> Got some allergy medicine again :D
02:11 * Ali crawls onto PinkieShy and bleps on top of
02:12 * PinkieShy licks Ali
02:15 * Ali squeaks loudly
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02:23 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Calpain: Nightly Discussion #2396 [ https://tinyurl.com/y4zpu26f ]
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03:28 <Schism> Box of dressing with gravy. It's basically just a big ol' bowl of bread.
03:36 * Ali noms on the Schism tail
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03:53 *** Quits: DerpyBot (DerpyBot@is.in.your.pants.eating.your.muffins) (The TLS connection was non-properly terminated.)
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03:53 *** ChanServ sets mode: +ao DerpyBot DerpyBot
03:54 <DerpyBot> *derp*
03:59 <Golden> Hm
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08:11 * Cepheid awakens.
08:23 *** Quits: cabbage (cabbage@Pony-aj9mbi.dynamic.sonic.net) (Connection closed)
08:44 * Ali rolls around from the cray cray
09:02 * Golden flops in a bit of an angry mood.
09:07 *** Joins: Dappled (IceChat9@Pony-6gbca1.ok.cox.net)
09:08 <Dappled> Well that's lame..
09:08 * Dappled installed a new hard drive but it's not showing up in the list. Will have to wait for my tech savy roommie to help.
09:11 * Ali licks Dappled nosie
09:11 * Dappled scrunchie nosie. Hello Ali.
09:11 * Dappled attempts to figure this out himself.
09:11 * Ali wavies hoof from boredom central
09:13 * Dappled hugs the Ali. He now has aprox 2 more terrabytes installed on his PC.
09:14 * Ali really wonders what Dappled needs all that space for
09:14 * Dappled would have installed the other harddrive, but didn't have any cords that could reach where it would have to be installed.
09:14 <Dappled> For what else? Having a bunch of games installed that I'll go months or years without playing.
09:15 <Ali> You know, you could, I dunno, uninstall them when not played?
09:15 * Dappled head scratches.
09:15 <Finwe> Good forenoon, everypony!
09:16 <Finwe> Miss Ali, Mr Dappled.
09:16 * Dappled checks to see if it indeed forenoon.
09:16 * Finwe doffs his hat.
09:16 * Dappled waves to Finwe.
09:16 <Finwe> Forenoon (EET). o3o
09:16 <Dappled> Yup. 3 Am is definitely before noon.
09:16 * Starlight_Glimmer sits on Ali
09:16 * Ali splats under Starlight_Glimmer
09:16 * Dappled assumes EET is a timezone?
09:16 <Starlight_Glimmer> rude!
09:16 <Finwe> It is.
09:17 * Dappled has gained knowledge!
09:17 <Starlight_Glimmer> People should just use UTC/GMT offsets.
09:17 * Dappled doesn't understand those either, Starlight_Glimmer.
09:17 <Finwe> GMT+2 then. o3o
09:18 <Starlight_Glimmer> Dappled: We're using UTC+1/GMT+1 around here.
09:18 <Starlight_Glimmer> Finwe says he's in GMT+2, so if I want to know his local time I just add one hour
09:19 <Starlight_Glimmer> It's that simple.
09:19 <Dappled> That sounds like math.
09:19 * Dappled isn't on the clock right now.
09:19 <Starlight_Glimmer> Silly names for time zones just confuse everybody.
09:19 * Dappled 's already confused.
09:19 * Dappled prefers to just set up multiple clocks in his phone and labels them as users he wants to keep track of.
09:20 <Ali> I believe EST is -4 right?
09:20 <Starlight_Glimmer> I'll get to that.
09:20 <Ali> Its 4:20AM here
09:20 <Starlight_Glimmer> For example: People will say they are in EST (UTC-5), but are they though?
09:20 <Finwe> Ali: -5.
09:21 <Starlight_Glimmer> Right now, Ali is correct and she's using EST.
09:21 <Ali> Its been awhile since I had to deal with that
09:21 * Dappled chews on sticks.
09:21 <Ali> I'm not in the same time zone as Dappled
09:21 <Dappled> We're kinda close.
09:21 * Dappled 's just one over.
09:21 <Ali> They're on Central, but I"m on Eastern
09:21 <Ali> WHich is a one hour offset
09:21 <Starlight_Glimmer> In summer though, despite what people think, with daylight savings time you change your timezone. Yes you heard correctly. The time doesn't change, you change timezones.
09:21 <Starlight_Glimmer> So that's EDT then.
09:22 <Ali> It changes to EDST in the summer
09:22 * Dappled thinks we should get rid of DST altogether.
09:22 * Ali burns DST as well
09:22 <Finwe> We don't have DS, just S.
09:22 <Starlight_Glimmer> Yeah, but people will continue to state times as EST
09:23 <Starlight_Glimmer> Which will confuse people like me, because calculations are off then.
09:23 <Ali> Its EST normallally, then EDST in the summer
09:23 <Finwe> EET becomes EEST, East European Summer Time.
09:23 <Ali> And I hate daylight savings
09:23 <Ali> State used to not follow it
09:23 <Starlight_Glimmer> So you might say O.K. that's fine I mean DST only happens twice a year, right?
09:23 <Starlight_Glimmer> WRONG! We change to DST at different times!
09:24 <Finwe> GMT becomes BST, British Summer Time, CET becomes CEST, Central European Summer Time.
09:24 <Ali> Yeah Europe's changes at a different time than the US
09:24 <Ali> The US is DST from March to November
09:24 <Finwe> Starlight_Glimmer: It's Summer Time in Europe,
09:24 <Dappled> Have mercy on a poor high school drop out.
09:24 <Finwe> not Daylight Saving Time.
09:24 <Starlight_Glimmer> Same difference ;)
09:24 <Finwe> It doesn't actually save any daylight.
09:25 * Dappled starts moving his tabletop rpg collection over to the new harddrive.
09:25 <Finwe> Neverwinter Nights is best RPG. o3o
09:25 * Dappled prefers 2.
09:26 <Dappled> When it works.
09:26 <Ali> I got annoyed by that female pally
09:26 <Ali> And I could never play 2 cause the sky was corrupted
09:26 * Dappled glares at the weird framerate issues he's gotten in 2 over the last few months.
09:27 * Dappled will move his emulators and roms over next. And that'll probably be it to start.
09:27 * Ali roms all over Dappled's pokemon games
09:28 <Starlight_Glimmer> You might have also notice Ali constantly saying EDST instead of EDT, which would be the correct notation. Well guess what she's isn't the only one doing that.
09:28 * Dappled does need to continue that. He's past Surge and ready to enter the dark cave. Cause he has flash.
09:28 <Starlight_Glimmer> Timezones are a giant mess!
09:28 * Ali thinks Dappled is weak to use that worthless HM
09:28 * Starlight_Glimmer sometimes loves to rant a bit
09:28 <Golden> I am a bit angry for someone RPing as Brendan from Pokemon keeps on hitting on my Unovian Ace Trainer OC.
09:28 <Dappled> Especially since it's all a lie to convince us that the world is round.
09:29 * Ali tries to remember who Brendan was
09:29 <Dappled> The planet is clearly donut shapped.
09:29 <Ali> I think there's a ......hole..... in your logic there.
09:29 <Dappled> I think that was Ruby/Sapphire.
09:29 <Ali> No, wait, Diamond and Pearl
09:29 <Ali> Steel type Gym Leader
09:29 <Golden> Brendan was the male player trainer from ruby/sapphire/emerald.
09:29 <Starlight_Glimmer> So in short: Use UTC offsets! They make sense! Or just use UTC in general, that's fine with me too.
09:29 <Ali> Or that
09:29 * Ali weees
09:29 * Dappled knows things.
09:29 * Ali ESTs all over Starlight_Glimmer
09:30 <Starlight_Glimmer> Next week's class: Why the 24 hour clock is clearly superior.
09:30 * Dappled hisses at that.
09:30 * Dappled gets a rolled up newspaper and swats 24 hour clocks.
09:30 <Golden> All I will say is that their advances are unwanted, and unwarranted. Especially since my OC has shown zero interest in him.
09:30 <Dappled> You'll never take me alive!
09:30 * Finwe decides to hiss at 14:27 earliest.
09:31 <Ali> And why you should use F over C~
09:31 <Starlight_Glimmer> And in the week after that we'll take about middle-endian date notations.
09:31 <Golden> They even tried the nice guy crud with "Oh I guess I will always be alone."
09:31 <Dappled> Nooooooo
09:31 * Ali throws the metric system in the trash!
09:31 <Dappled> Did you tell them to respect boundaries?
09:31 * Finwe noms on every centimetre of Ali's tail.
09:32 <Golden> I out right told them in character that they will only be friends.
09:32 * Ali finds it funny, her tail is not measured in that!~
09:32 <Golden> When I said that was when they brought out the nice guy stuff.
09:33 <Starlight_Glimmer> Ali: I'll give you: Miles does sound better when used in lyrics.
09:34 <Ali> Don't know how you'd walk 500 meters and it sound good
09:34 <Starlight_Glimmer> Also imperial units have been defined by metric units for some time now. You're all secretly using the metric system.
09:34 * Ali still thinks F is better than C :P
09:35 <Dappled> Which is why we should start using K. I'm sure that will be super usefull.
09:36 <Starlight_Glimmer> You mean the unit defined by an inaccurate measurement of the body temperature? That sounds great!
09:36 <Starlight_Glimmer> (ref. Fahrenheit)
09:37 <Ali> I just used F cause I can't spell
09:37 <Ali> I just understand it better than Celcius
09:38 <Starlight_Glimmer> The nice thing is: It has of course been redefined using the same points used for Celcius, just with weird decimal numbers.
09:39 <Ali> Cept the few times when they coincide with each other
09:39 <Ali> like 212F/100C and 32F/0C
09:39 <Golden> I even use massive hints that my oc is uncomfortable with him to the point they change the way they dress to avoid getting stared at by gim.
09:39 <Finwe> °F and °C. F and C are faraday and coulomb, respectively. o3o
09:40 <Finwe> The units of capacitance and electric charge.
09:40 <Starlight_Glimmer> Celsius is so easy!. 0°C = freezing point of water, 100°C = boiling point of water (all at sea level with 1 ATM of pressure)
09:41 * Dappled doesn't see how that's relevant.
09:41 * Dappled doesn't live at sea level with 1 Automatic Teller Machine pressuring me.
09:42 <Starlight_Glimmer> Pressure changes boiling and freezing points
09:42 <Starlight_Glimmer> It's the same for Fahrenheit.
09:42 <Dappled> Right. But most (I assume) don't live at sea level.
09:42 <Ali> Its why places with higher elevations have varried cooking times
09:43 * Dappled also doesn't need to know the temperature water boils at.
09:43 * Dappled just keeps applying heat till bubbles happen.
09:44 * Ali facehooves
09:44 <Starlight_Glimmer> I'd be O.K. with Kelvin as well. Scale is the same as Celsius, just with an offset.
09:44 <Starlight_Glimmer> Fahrenheit is a bit off though
09:44 <Starlight_Glimmer> One doesn't base a scale one a thing that isn't constant in the first place.
09:44 * Dappled suspects Starlight_Glimmer of being a communist.
09:45 <Finwe> Hammer_And_Sickle_Glimmer o3o
09:46 * Golden is gonna go hold his Lopmon plush.
09:46 * Dappled checks his pokedex... Doesn't find a Lopmon. Must be a new legendary.
09:46 <Ali> Not your temperature, but OUR temperature
09:46 <Finwe> "Auferstanden aus Ruinen und der Zukunft zugewandt, laß uns dir zum Guten dienen…"
09:46 * Ali tries to get a meltan from Dappled
09:46 <Dappled> It's my meltan.
09:47 * Dappled holds it tightly.
09:47 * Ali only has eons..and they're gimped, but she loves them
09:47 <Starlight_Glimmer> At least this way I can say I'll cook Ali at 100° and nopony can proof I'm out to do any harm ;)
09:47 <Starlight_Glimmer> prove*
09:48 <Finwe> Could be an angle, though. o3o
09:48 <Ali> You couldn't like my fire that high anyway~
09:48 <Finwe> But every sensible pony measures angles in radians.
09:48 <Ali> I'd be obtuse, because I'm not acute
09:48 <Finwe> Ali is a cute pony. o3o
09:48 <Dappled> Pay attention this year, it being the 25th anniversary, I'm sure that a lot of the mythics are going to be released again this year.
09:48 <Golden> Dappled Lopmon is a digimon. The plush of which I ordered came in today. Basically the Brendan rper has me so riled up I am using the plush for comfort.
09:48 <Ali> Dappled, as long as its not distributed thru HOME
09:49 * Dappled was making a silly.
09:49 <Dappled> It almost certainly will be. They want people on it.
09:49 * Ali sits on Finwe and puffycheeks
09:49 <Ali> Like how they want to force you to use Nintendo Online
09:49 * Starlight_Glimmer has never bothered
09:49 <Ali> Cause the raid battles with AI are on purposely designed to be god awful
09:50 <Ali> Dappled, you know Heliodisk right?
09:50 <Starlight_Glimmer> Have you noticed games generally have been designed to be awful in the last couple of years?
09:50 <Ali> Only the last couple?
09:50 * Finwe noms on Starlight_Glimmer's SED badge.
09:50 <Ali> I think the last ten or so at least
09:50 *** Joins: ConfusionRift (ConfusionRi@Pony-uap.qic.144.136.IP)
09:50 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o ConfusionRift
09:50 <Ali> Ever since DLC went ham and then lootboxes
09:51 <Finwe> Lt Cdr ConfusionRift.
09:51 <Finwe> o7
09:51 <Starlight_Glimmer> Live services! Micro (read macro) transactions!
09:51 <ConfusionRift> RAdm. Finwe. (salutes)
09:51 <Golden> Heya Confusion.
09:52 * Starlight_Glimmer applies horse armor to Ali
09:52 <Ali> Good old Oblivion
09:52 <Ali> and the Horse Armor DLC
09:52 <Finwe> :3
09:52 <Dappled> Looks like my only catch for Route 10 is Voltorb. Already got a Spearow and Ekans.
09:53 <Finwe> Although Skyrim is better Equestrian game than Oblivion.
09:53 <Starlight_Glimmer> I mean since it's horse armor it might be a bit big, you know *snickers*
09:53 * Dappled looks at Skyrim horse head tracking.
09:53 * Dappled shudders.
09:54 <Dappled> Horses have the better side vision than head on, like most prey cause they have to keep a look out for predators.
09:54 <Dappled> In skyrim they look at you head on.
09:54 <Ali> Or the fact that horses in Skyrim can launch you just about anywhere
09:54 <Finwe> Skyrim basics of getting almost anywhere you like: 1) get a horse 2) press space 3) ? 4) profit
09:54 <Dappled> This implies that skyrim horses are not prey animals, but predators.
09:54 <Ali> Find the kajeet[sp] secret stash
09:55 <Golden> All are prey to Mud Crabs
09:55 <Starlight_Glimmer> Well clearly Dappled you haven't met AppleJack yet.
09:55 <Finwe> If you've got the coin, Khajiit has stuff.
09:55 <Starlight_Glimmer> You know she raises pigs and all.
09:56 * Dappled glares at that episode where they had to do AppleJack's chores. That episode bugs me so much.
09:56 <Dappled> Cause of her sprinkler system.
09:56 <Dappled> Who has that many sections of pipe with valves? Really?
09:57 <Dappled> Like, did she just order nothing but those?
09:57 * Dappled glares at unrealistic portrayal of pipe systems in a childrens cartoon series.
09:57 <Finwe> The Sky Temple Balconny is a rare exception. You can reach it with a horse but you cannot get over the perimeter because there is some invisible barrier blocking the way.
09:57 <Finwe> s/n//
09:58 * Golden curls up a bit.
09:58 * Dappled hugs the Golden.
09:58 <Dappled> Also no Voltorb for me. This Butterfree is evil.
09:58 <Dappled> This is the second poke it's cost me by crit tackling them to death.
09:59 <Golden> Thanks Dappled....also Nuzlocke I am guessing
09:59 <Dappled> Yeah.
09:59 <Finwe> I think you cannot reach the Sky Temple even if you try with a bucket, unless you've advanced the main questline far enough.
09:59 * Dappled 's never beaten one.
10:00 <ConfusionRift> In cartoons, the simplest of things are always seen daunting. :P
10:01 <Finwe> I wonder how the Skyblivion project is coming along.
10:02 <Dappled> You know, now that I have all this extra space, I can actually have mods again. Wheee.
10:02 <Finwe> Might well happen that the next Elder Scrolls game is released before.
10:02 <Finwe> https://skyblivion.com/
10:12 <Ali> And you can defeat Ganon with a bottle
10:13 * Dappled ships Ganon and Zelda.
10:13 * ConfusionRift grabs the bottle, and throws it at his face. He falls and dies. "The woild is saved!:
10:13 *** Quits: PinkieShy (coolm@Pony-ck81je.67-212-45-net.sccoast.net) (Connection closed)
10:15 <Dappled> Well at least I couldn't crit tackle the Geodude. Whee, I get a Golem for my Nuzlocke.
10:15 * Ali thinks trade evo's should be abolished
10:16 <Dappled> I agree.
10:16 * ConfusionRift thinks so too.
10:16 * Dappled is luckily playing a rom and has disable trade evolutions.
10:20 * Dappled claps his hooves happily. All his storage space bars are blue instead of red again.
10:27 * Ali nibbles on the Dappled ears
10:27 * Dappled ear flaps at the Ali.
10:27 * Dappled was under the impression that Flash made it easier to see, but rock tunnel is well lit, why did I waste a move on this HM?
10:33 <Ali> And that right there is why I poked fun at you picking up flash :P
10:33 <Dappled> Doesn't it work like that in other generations though? You use it to light up dark caves?
10:35 <Ali> It does, but in Gen 1, most of the caves are easy to navigate on a bright enough PC or GB
10:36 * Dappled chews on a stick.
10:37 * ConfusionRift puts in a code. "Let there BE LIGHT!" The trainer shines so bright, every cave is well lit.
10:39 * Golden is gonna try to sleep. He really isn't in the mood to grind for a shiny bagon, trapinch, magnamite, and shiny gible after the annoyance he went through tonight.
10:42 * Dappled wants more shinies.
10:43 * Dappled also wants to build a thing to automate his shiny breeding so he can just walk away from the switch and check back every few hours.
10:44 <Golden> Eh I prefer manual five eggs at a time. I feel like if it was automated then it would kinda dampen the shock of one hatching
10:45 * Dappled desires only to have. But not by cheating. That would be bad.
10:46 <Golden> Can agree about the cheating being bad. Anyway good night
10:48 <ConfusionRift> Have a good one.
10:53 * Ali just can't push thru SnS, its just so....boring
10:54 * Dappled is running out of items in the rock tunnel. Is about to have to escape rope out or risk losing pokes.
10:56 *** Joins: RazorSharpFang (FourthChoic@Pony-a6ggs4.tpgi.com.au)
10:56 <RazorSharpFang> Evening.
10:58 * Dappled crawls into Lavendar Town. Wheeee.... Bed time.
10:59 * Ali licks RazorSharpFang
10:59 <RazorSharpFang> Hey heys
11:10 <Cepheid> Hoi.
11:11 <Cepheid> After reading a bit of news, I've come to the conclusion that psychologists and psychiatrists everywhere are considering drinking themselves to oblivion when they try to comprehend Mr. Trump.
11:18 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Calpain: Morning Discussion #2168 [ https://tinyurl.com/y5pzmyja ]
11:20 * Lumindia flumps on Ali
11:20 * Ali splats under Lumindia
11:21 <Starlight_Glimmer> I don't think he's particularly difficult to understand. Don't over analyze his actions. Sometimes the simple explanations are the correct ones.
11:21 <Cepheid> Let me rephrase.
11:21 <Cepheid> "When they try to comprehend why Trump isn't in an asylum yet."
11:21 * Starlight_Glimmer thinks Ali must be made out of straws.
11:22 <Cepheid> Most people that delusional would likely either just be ignored, or admitted to a psych ward and constant observation for their safety.
11:22 <Lumindia> Ceph: I couldn't keep myself off twitter yesterday watching everything happen... I know it probably wasn't healthy for me, but I can't very well ignore something this big happening to my country...
11:23 <Cepheid> ... Netflix? Why are you offering your services to me in Turkish Lira pricing?
11:23 <Lumindia> On a related note, I think I'll actually take your advice and reschedule my next therapist appointment to be earlier
11:23 <Cepheid> Ah.
11:23 <Cepheid> It's a phishing email.
11:23 * Ali also tells Cepheid that their computer is obsoleted
11:23 <Ali> Or was it microsoft account was obsolete?
11:23 <Ali> either way, stupid scam is stupid
11:25 * ConfusionRift smiles at the super easy "hard mode" run of Timespinner. "NG+ is a blast."
11:25 <Cepheid> I passed it onto their phishing scam processing service.
11:25 <Cepheid> I told them that either that e-mail was a phishing e-mail, or Netflix is extremely confused as to where I live.
11:25 <Cepheid> ... In not so polite words because spam.
11:26 <Cepheid> Man, I'd love to set up that new TV of mine.
11:26 <Cepheid> But there's problems.
11:27 <Cepheid> See, the thing weighs 41lbs, first off.
11:27 <Cepheid> And secondly? It's 55", and the box is freakishly huge.
11:27 <Cepheid> My mother's sick, so I can't trust her to help me with setting it up, and my dad leaves for work at around 7:00-7:30 AM.
11:27 <Cepheid> And probably won't be back until like, 3 PM.
11:28 <ConfusionRift> Are you putting it on a wall mount?
11:28 <Cepheid> Debating that, actually. I'm not too comfortable with using it with the wall mount I have.
11:28 <Cepheid> I'm thinking I'll set it up on my desk.
11:29 <Starlight_Glimmer> The packaging around here is pretty simple usually, you should be able to do it on your own with little issues.
11:30 <Cepheid> True.
11:30 <Cepheid> Lay it flat on the back, install the feet. 40lbs isn't much for two people, even if one is sick.
11:31 <ConfusionRift> I don't think the issue would be weight or the packaging, or even setting it up. A 55 inch screen is pretty big and can be a hassle to move around. One can do it solo with careful movement, but can also go wrong pretty fast.
11:31 <Cepheid> Yeah.
11:31 <Cepheid> Hence why I want a second person.
11:32 * Ali rolls over to Starlight_Glimmer
11:32 * Starlight_Glimmer installed a 86" (yes) panel at work. That actually required 3 people.
11:32 <Cepheid> Heh.
11:33 <Cepheid> 55" was actually the smallest I could get for this type, that was of a decent quality, so...
11:33 <Starlight_Glimmer> My TV is 40" I believe. I basically never use it.
11:34 <Cepheid> In this case, I intend to use it as a monitor.
11:34 <Cepheid> My current one is... sufficient, for such a use, but it has it's problems. Mostly in the form of excessive burnin after even a minute of an image being on the screen.
11:34 <Cepheid> Imagine playing a game on it with the Windows 10 default background burned into it.
11:34 <ConfusionRift> The other option would be to do everything on your desk. Put the package with the screen facing up on the desk, open it and slowly slide the screen out while it remains on the table, put the legs on, and then it's just the case of tilting. Thing is, I know it's 40ish pounds, but what kind of screen is it?
11:35 <Cepheid> QLED, thin model type.
11:36 * Cepheid looks at this item she acquired in Ys 6. It lights up the area, and reveals secrets. "..."
11:36 * Cepheid goes back to all previous dungeons.
11:36 <ConfusionRift> Maybe it's doable. Alas, for the sake of not risking it, and second person would be better. (back to square #1)
11:37 <Cepheid> I'll ask my mother, after setting it up.
11:38 <Cepheid> Even sick, she's more than capable of lifting half of 40lbs.
11:38 <Cepheid> Truth told, were it not for the injured leg, and her neck, she would probably have been able to lift it with ease by herself. Contrary to her appearance, she's distressingly strong.
11:38 <Starlight_Glimmer> It's safer for sure. Just saying that if you really wanted to you /could/ do it yourself.
11:39 <Cepheid> Yeah, I know, I know.
11:40 <Cepheid> I like how Falcom handles "secret entrances revealed by this item"
11:40 <Cepheid> There's absolutely no way, prior to getting the item to A) Use the entrance, or B) Even know it's there.
11:40 <Cepheid> The item in question always changes the geometry of the entrance. That is, a wall literally changes into a doorway.
11:42 <Cepheid> Oh, great. Enemies that can easily hit me multiple times if I try to rush attack them, or move while attacking them.
11:43 <Cepheid> And they poison too! Granted, it's 1 HP every 2-3 seconds.
11:44 <Cepheid> Hilariously they drop items to cure poison with alarming regularity.
11:45 * ConfusionRift looks at Cepheid's Steam.
11:46 <Cepheid> Yes?
11:46 <Cepheid> Oh, that.
11:46 <Cepheid> Yeah, I was configuring something.
11:46 <ConfusionRift> Aah. :P
11:46 <Cepheid> Unfortunately, configuring it requires hitting "play" multiple times.
11:46 <Cepheid> Because the config tool is separate from the game.
11:46 <ConfusionRift> It's a splash screen menu, huh.
11:47 <Cepheid> Sorta.
11:47 <ConfusionRift> Or a start-up configuration screen.
11:47 <Cepheid> You press Play, and Steam asks you to choose either the config tool or the game.
11:47 <ConfusionRift> Oh, that.
11:47 <Cepheid> Basically I was switching to Windowed mode, 1440p, so I could see chat at the same time.
11:48 <Cepheid> Ys 1 through 7 or so are not new games.
11:48 <Cepheid> They were made in the early 2000-2010 range, approximately.
11:48 <Cepheid> So the tools and engines aren't the greatest. Amazingly though I much prefer the Ark of Napishtim engine over say, the one from Celceta, and probably Ys 7.
11:49 <Cepheid> I haven't played 7 yet. Working on 6, Ark of Napishtim.
11:49 <ConfusionRift> Oh I'm aware. :P
11:49 <Cepheid> Oh be quiet you. :P
11:51 <Cepheid> I wonder if I can set a dark theme for GTK2 running under Windows.
11:51 <Cepheid> Apparently I can.
11:54 <Cepheid> I am legitimately surprised that worked.
11:56 <ConfusionRift> For (bleep) sake! I forgot about the lightwall pendant!
11:56 <Cepheid> What game?
11:57 <ConfusionRift> Timespinner.
11:57 <Cepheid> Ah, right.
12:00 <ConfusionRift> Just like in the original run, I dismissed the Lightwall pendant from being a mobility item, and was doing circles going nowhere... again.
12:02 <Cepheid> Heh.
12:02 <Cepheid> Meanwhile, I have to grind a bit.
12:02 <Cepheid> Fortunately these slimes give a reasonable amount of EXP for my level. About 3-4% per.
12:03 <Cepheid> It's unfortunate they don't drop a healing item instead of this poison curative.
12:03 <Cepheid> It'd be easier to make money, with the rate they drop these curatives.
12:04 *** Joins: Fn (Eogan@Pony-03u6hj.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
12:04 <Cepheid> On the other hand, they actually drop a lot of money for what amounts to a pile of goo.
12:05 <Cepheid> Hum, all weapons to 7... Wonder what the maximum level is. I'm guessing 10?
12:07 <Cepheid> Hum. Monstrum Nox comes out early February. Wonder if NISA learned their lesson with Ys 8.
12:07 *** Quits: FruitNibbler (Eogan@Pony-2gsetq.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
12:08 <Cepheid> Schism, you ever hear from Sara(Did I remember their name right?) why Falcom switched to NISA for localizing Ys?
12:14 * Cepheid tries something out of curiousity.
12:15 * Cepheid goes invisible as to avoid bugging CR.
12:16 <ConfusionRift> hey, I was just foolin', and was just wondering is all.
12:16 <ConfusionRift> :P
12:18 <Cepheid> Heh. :P
12:18 <Cepheid> So much for that theory.
12:18 <Cepheid> See, the default configuration for an XBox 360 controller is a bit... wonky.
12:18 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Open My Little Pony Art Compilation (All Skill Levels Welcome) #74 + Cheerilee and Friends Open Art! [ https://tinyurl.com/yyzz52xo ]
12:19 <Cepheid> It assigns camp to L3, and previous weapon is L1, while next weapon is inexplicably the start button.
12:19 <Cepheid> Which implies this may not have been the intended controller.
12:23 <Cepheid> Now, given that they did initially port the Ark engine games to the PSP, that made me wonder if maybe a PSP-layout-like controller might have been intended.
12:24 <Cepheid> That appears not to have been the case.
12:25 <Cepheid> There's actually two other possible reasons.
12:26 <Cepheid> 1) They designed for a controller that they personally use at Falcom. 2) The XBox 360 controller actually has two variations, one is wired, the other wireless. For reasons unknown, Microsoft has assigned the buttons differently between the two, with respect to Windows.
12:26 <Cepheid> This is actually made apparent by playing games that recognize the 360 controller. Some games will treat both the wireless and wired version as the same, but the controls will be all messed up for the wireless version.
12:27 <Cepheid> Though I think that's more of an interface thing.
12:27 <Cepheid> Like, raw input over XInput, or vice versa.
12:27 <Cepheid> Because XInput handles both controller types just fine, and assigns the buttons accordingly, because you access them through identifiers such as "A_BUTTON" "B_BUTTON" and so on.
12:29 <Cepheid> If you're thinking "Wow, that's needlessly complicated" or "Why would you use raw input over XInput?" then you're not far off the mark about a lot of things relating to controller programming.
12:30 <Cepheid> The reason for the raw input though, and this is hearsay as far as I am concerned until I test it myself, but raw input is supposedly more efficient and lower latency.
12:30 * Lumindia flumps
12:33 <Cepheid> ... I suppose that's why there's a 20,000 gold poison resist charm.
12:33 <ConfusionRift> I think that would be the case. XInput and DInput basically have to be, I guess we can call it, translated. Raw input tells a system a direction/coordinate. The others have to be read, verified, and then executed.
12:34 <Cepheid> Raw input just reports "Button # was pressed" or "Axis # was moved."
12:34 <Cepheid> Where # is a number.
12:34 <Cepheid> As a result, for different devices, you need to map those numbers to an icon.
12:35 <Cepheid> The usual way to do this is to look at the GUID of the device. All devices report one, apparently, and it's unique across all instances of a single model of that device.
12:35 <Cepheid> So for example, every single wireless controller of the same version and model as mine will report the same GUID, which allows you to identify it.
12:36 <Cepheid> Meanwhile, the Switch joycons themselves all have the same GUID for joycons. I think, anyways. At least, I expect the open-source driver that pairs with them to properly assign the same GUID.
12:36 <Cepheid> This is how games can switch icon sets accordingly, outside of the simpler approach of letting the user pick the icon set themselves.
12:36 <Cepheid> For the love of the gods though, don't do what X4 does.
12:37 <Cepheid> I tried my X52 HOTAS with it yesterday. It reports each button as a number. So, instead of the labels on the joystick and throttles, it reports "Press button 1, 34, 55, 83, 256 to do X."
12:37 <Cepheid> And it's like... "what?"
12:38 <Cepheid> Meanwhile, Elite sees it as a Saitek X52, but that's fine because apparently that's what the Logitech X52 is based off of. So they're effectively identical except in quality and construction.
12:38 <Cepheid> And Elite uses the button labels.
12:38 <Cepheid> So you see "Press A" or "Press C" or "Push this hat."
12:38 <Lumindia> that seems... inconvenient
12:38 <Cepheid> It is.
12:38 <Cepheid> For X4.
12:39 <Cepheid> I plan to mod the game, adding in the missing icons in the place of the buttons 1 through 2048.
12:39 <Lumindia> wait hold up. HOW MANY buttons?
12:39 <Cepheid> I'm joking about the number.
12:39 <Cepheid> The buttons go up to something like 32, I think. Let me see.
12:39 <Lumindia> oh okay
12:39 <Lumindia> that's much more reasonable
12:40 <Cepheid> Yeah, 32 buttons.
12:40 *** Quits: Ali (Ali@Pony-qdffrb.4nua.5fca.1702.2600.IP) (Quit: Leaving)
12:40 <Cepheid> Not including axes.
12:40 <Cepheid> Still, seeing "Press button 27" and not knowing what button 27 is assigned to is a bit annoying.
12:41 <Lumindia> so it's goign to be a matter of trial and error finding out what button is what?
12:41 <Cepheid> Or use a guide.
12:41 <Cepheid> https://www.reddit.com/r/X4Foundations/comments/a1tqel/saitek_x52_pro_button_number_map/
12:41 <ConfusionRift> Not surprised, considering the controller in question. Was the case with older games that had controller/joystick support.
12:41 <Cepheid> Same button configuration as this, so that diagram works.
12:41 <Cepheid> I think it's more just, it's a pain in the ass for developers to create icon sets for every setup out there.
12:41 <Lumindia> ooo
12:41 <ConfusionRift> Oh, and some imports.
12:41 <Lumindia> flight stick thing?
12:42 <Cepheid> But it'd be a better idea to do something like, let the user label the buttons and axes so that when the game shows them, it uses the labels assigned by the user.
12:42 <Cepheid> Yeah Lumindia.
12:42 <Lumindia> that's cool
12:42 <Cepheid> I wanted one for Christmas, parents got me one.
12:42 <Cepheid> It's very nice, even if I can't use it well yet.
12:42 <Cepheid> But it's... more immersive.
12:45 <Cepheid> ... I cannot believe Falcom pulled this off.
12:45 <Cepheid> A dungeon in which I can get lost.
12:46 <Cepheid> Time to solve this the simple way. Draw a map.
12:51 * ConfusionRift decides to randomize the map at certain intervals. :P
12:52 <Cepheid> It doesn't, fortunately.
12:52 <Cepheid> But this place is huge. I already count 13 rooms and it's not even half of what I already explored.
12:53 <Cepheid> ... Okay, I'm curious.
12:53 <Cepheid> The Galba armor poisons me in return for good defense.
12:53 <Cepheid> The shield, it provides strength and defense, but doesn't seem to have a downside.
12:53 <Cepheid> What's the catch?
12:55 <RazorSharpFang> 40 minutes until Coronal Mass Ejection.
12:56 <Cepheid> Oooh.
12:56 <Cepheid> Hum. Save point, midway.
12:57 <ConfusionRift> Can't seem to find any issue with said shield. Just that the armor does poison you for added defense. You'll need an item it mitigate that.
12:57 <ConfusionRift> *to
12:59 <Cepheid> I'm not paying 20,000 gold for an item that mitigates what amounts to 1 damage every 2-3 seconds.
13:00 * ConfusionRift shrugs. "Alright then."
13:00 <Cepheid> To give a comparison.
13:00 <Cepheid> An item to deal with curse was 1,100 gold.
13:00 <Schism> Ys V at this time, Cepheid?
13:01 <Cepheid> Six.
13:01 <Cepheid> I finished Ys V last week.
13:01 <Schism> Aha.
13:01 * Schism is awake now. And hasn't, but she should ask.
13:01 <Cepheid> I gotta admit the translation wasn't the best for that one.
13:01 <Cepheid> Either that, or the text of that game was just a jumble to begin with.
13:01 <Cepheid> It seemed Falcom wasn't exactly skilled at coding the SNES.
13:02 <Schism> I'm sure it was a bit of both: Ys V kind of fell through in general.
13:02 <Cepheid> Not as badly as Ys 3 did.
13:03 *** Quits: Golden (uid250033@Pony-mioavt.c2vi.m095.067c.2001.IP) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
13:03 <Schism> Also, brrrr. I want to curl back up under blankets.
13:03 <Cepheid> Okay, that's everything that I can explore mapped out.
13:03 <Cepheid> But yeah, their SNES games weren't the greatest.
13:03 <Cepheid> It's like they had no idea what they were doing.
13:04 <Cepheid> Which is probably why for Ys 4, they went to third-party companies.
13:04 <Cepheid> But then that resulted in two separate versions of Ys 4, the Mask of the Sun and The Dawn of Ys, both of which were effectively retconned.
13:05 <Cepheid> With Ys: Memories of Celceta.
13:05 <Cepheid> And then Falcom did and went something ridiculous.
13:05 <Cepheid> Although they retconned Ys 4, officially, they hint that any of the 3 games labeled as Ys 4 could be canon.
13:05 <Cepheid> So, it's up to player choice which version is the canon version.
13:06 <RazorSharpFang> Naturally all the choices are wrong.
13:06 <Schism> Hehe.
13:06 <ConfusionRift> I hate the lab I hate the lab I hate the lab I hate the lab. (hears glass breaking) I HATE THE LAB I HATE THE LAB-!!!
13:07 <Schism> ConfusionRift, which lab?
13:07 <Cepheid> Alright FINE I'll buy the danged talisman for 20,000 gold.
13:07 <Cepheid> I got 22,000 anyways, so..
13:08 <Cepheid> ... Oh.
13:08 <Cepheid> I get an item for clearing out the store.
13:08 * Lumindia boops Schism
13:08 <ConfusionRift> Schism: Went back to Timespinner. NG+ on Hard Mode to compensate.
13:09 <Cepheid> Hum, I wonder what the maximum sword upgrade level is. It's not 8.
13:09 <Schism> Ah yes. I should finish that game... I keep getting distracted by the 5,000 games on my to-do list.
13:10 <Cepheid> Oh look, enemies I cannot kill.
13:11 <Cepheid> And a room jam pack- Oh, I recognize these, the NPCs mentioned an enemy in this cave that can't be hurt without a bell.
13:12 <Cepheid> Okay this place went from "Eh difficulty" to "Why?"
13:14 <RazorSharpFang> 21 minutes until Coronal Mass Ejection
13:15 <ConfusionRift> Schism: NG+ let's you keep most items and weapons. Of course, progress items are gone... at least they let you keep the dash. :P
13:16 <Schism> <Apollo> She's LEVEL 78!
13:16 <Cepheid> Oooh, a boss.
13:16 <Schism> Level! Seventy-EIGHT!
13:18 <Cepheid> I do in the neighborhood of "sweet ****-all" to this boss.
13:18 <Cepheid> I need to kill those strong enemies and gain some levels, I guess.
13:18 <ConfusionRift> Okay, I take it all back. Nothing is worst than the emperor tower guards and their stupid energy shields.
13:18 * ConfusionRift points at Schism for hacking. :P
13:20 <Lumindia> Haaaaax!
13:20 * Lumindia throws a monitor at Schism
13:20 <Cepheid> RazorSharpFang: I'll be on in a bit.
13:22 <Schism> Heh. Cute reversal. https://twitter.com/Lyytoaoitori/status/1347147581957267456
13:25 <Cepheid> Heh.
13:26 <Schism> Also: https://twitter.com/RunaPocket/status/1346829496012345345
13:32 <Schism> (Yes, that video is played backwards, but still.)
13:33 <ConfusionRift> Blarg, time for sleep. Laters!
13:33 *** Quits: ConfusionRift (ConfusionRi@Pony-uap.qic.144.136.IP) (Quit: Recharging the batteries. Laters! *shutdown*)
14:11 *** Joins: Cyan_Spark (Cyan_Spark@sparks.only.last.so.long)
14:12 <Cyan_Spark> Razor the investor
14:17 <RazorSharpFang> Hey heys
14:17 <RazorSharpFang> AT&T is up to 30 now.
14:19 <Schism> I take it that the market's a bit red today after yesterday's events.
14:20 * Lumindia flumps, melts
14:20 <Cyan_Spark> Markets were green as yesterday unfolded
14:21 <RazorSharpFang> I don't understand how everything could be so green all at once. What happened yesterday?
14:21 <Schism> An insurgency stormed the White House.
14:22 <ADragonDreaming> Not that I understand why that would boost the stock market
14:22 <Schism> I guess the 34th rule of acquisition is corret.
14:22 <Schism> correct*
14:22 <ADragonDreaming> Yet more evidence that the stock market is not reflective of actual reality in any way.
14:23 <RazorSharpFang> "X million unemployed, highest ever" - Stocks go up
14:24 <Schism> Why wouldn't stocks go up? The richest people in the world have at least a trillion dollars more in their pockets.
14:25 <Cyan_Spark> Stocks go up because people don't seem to know where else to put money into
14:30 <Cyan_Spark> TSLA is ATH, again, 778.04
14:30 <Cyan_Spark> Reference: was 695 right before S&P500 inclusion
14:32 <Cyan_Spark> Apparently, the logic is, Dems win -> $2000 stimulus check -> Markets go up
14:32 <Cyan_Spark> Reps win -> GOP gridlock -> Taxes can't increase -> Markets go up
14:37 <Heartbreak> *coughs*
14:40 *** Quits: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net) (Connection closed)
14:41 * Finwe ruffles Heartbreak and offers some cough tincture.
14:41 <Cyan_Spark> Markets are very green and I'm cash gang 🙃
14:46 *** Joins: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net)
14:46 *** Quits: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net) (Connection closed)
14:48 *** Joins: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net)
14:56 *** Joins: LibrarianofHope (Librarianof@Pony-8qu.6k1.114.201.IP)
14:56 <LibrarianofHope> owo
14:56 <LibrarianofHope> you do stocks?
14:57 <ADragonDreaming> stonks
14:57 <LibrarianofHope> stunks
14:57 <Lumindia> stonks
14:57 <Lumindia> stink
14:57 <Lumindia> stank
14:57 <Lumindia> stunk
14:58 <LibrarianofHope> yeet
14:58 <Schism> Everyone loves a stonky.
14:58 <LibrarianofHope> i really like wall street stories
14:58 <LibrarianofHope> like actual books telling about the crashes
14:59 <LibrarianofHope> its always someone being greedy/dumb, then the system crashes
14:59 <Starlight_Glimmer> Not quite as easy as that, but yes market crashes are part of the business.
15:00 <ADragonDreaming> Audit Wall Street.
15:00 <ADragonDreaming> I know there's tax evasion going on there
15:00 * Lumindia boops Starlight_Glimmer on the snoot
15:00 <Starlight_Glimmer> That's a good thing though. Smaller crashes prevent larger bubbles. Also a good opportunity to make money.
15:01 * Starlight_Glimmer nibbles on Lumindia's ear
15:01 * Lumindia squeak
15:01 * Lumindia earflicks
15:01 * Starlight_Glimmer likes ears lots
15:01 * Lumindia counternibbles
15:02 <ADragonDreaming> I think everyone in finance, investment, etc. should be forced to take full courses on philosophy and the actual purpose of money, stressing the pointlessness of continual accumulation.
15:03 <Starlight_Glimmer> That being said a word of warning: If you advocate for day tranding here prepare for a lession on how markets work and why that's a dumb idea.
15:03 <RazorSharpFang> I trade options. This is not day trading though.
15:03 <Starlight_Glimmer> Odd. I was under the impression most day trader were using options due to the large leverage.
15:04 <RazorSharpFang> Yes - but the way I use options is not day-trading. Most of my positions are open between 15-45 days
15:04 <Starlight_Glimmer> ADragonDreaming: It's easy to think people in the financial world are evil. That's - as with most parts of society - certainly true to an extent. It's not quite as bad as you may think though.
15:04 <RazorSharpFang> I'm an options seller though, so sometimes I get assigned on my short contracts, which is fine because I'm aware of what that entails and ensure the account can handle that.
15:06 <ADragonDreaming> Oh, I'm not targeting you with that comment.
15:06 <ADragonDreaming> I'm targeting Wall Street.
15:06 <Starlight_Glimmer> Take it from me: I worked several years for the 2nd largest financial service provider (fancy word for bank) in Germany. You might call it bias, but I'm pretty sure I'm not looking at things through rose tinted glasses here. Some of the practices I did certainly not agree with.
15:06 <RazorSharpFang> Which is made of people, some like me.
15:06 <ADragonDreaming> Wall Street drives a whole bunch of short-sighted nonsense.
15:06 <Starlight_Glimmer> I also work in IT now, so there's that ;)
15:06 <ADragonDreaming> Growth for growth's sake
15:07 <RazorSharpFang> ADragonDreaming, as it happens, those short-sighted people are likely who I'm selling these options to. That, and /r/WallStreetBets
15:07 <Starlight_Glimmer> Well our economy wouldn't work without growth, but certainly especially on Wall Street it's a bit excessive.
15:08 * Finwe noms on RazorSharpFang's butterfly spreads.
15:09 <Starlight_Glimmer> But short sellers are often portrayed quite negatively for example, but when the market is working correctly they serve an important purpose. They uncovered numerous scams and can help stabilize prices.
15:09 <RazorSharpFang> Finwe, I'm not doing any butterfly spreads.
15:09 <LibrarianofHope> as far as i researched, its not evil, just dumb in a not fully understanding the ramiifcations
15:09 <Finwe> Not the ones you spread on your sandwiches, mind my words.
15:09 * Cyan_Spark waves
15:09 <RazorSharpFang> Starlight_Glimmer, I still see people petitioning the government to ban short-selling though.
15:09 <Cyan_Spark> I'm a swing trader
15:09 <Finwe> RazorSharpFang: Just speculating?
15:10 <ADragonDreaming> There's a point at which growth no longer makes sense.
15:10 <LibrarianofHope> short selling is not ohnerently bad, if i undestand the system right
15:10 <ADragonDreaming> Growth for growth's sake mentalities lead to the merger idiocy we see recently.
15:10 <RazorSharpFang> Finwe, no. I am the one selling options to others who are speculating. I am an insurance salesman.
15:10 <LibrarianofHope> me too owo
15:11 <LibrarianofHope> im an insurance agent
15:11 <Starlight_Glimmer> Same is true for options as well. They're a very high risk, high leverage instrument, but can help stabilize pricing and can be used as "insurance" or to fix prices for resources required in the future. Used correctly the mitigate risk. That's unfortunately not how they're used most often at the moment.
15:11 <Cyan_Spark> I dumped about a third of my liquidity into a stock, watched it drop 8%, decided that was too much risk, and sold half of that for 1% profit today :P
15:11 <Cyan_Spark> Right now it's up 5% compared to my original breakeven
15:12 <Finwe> RazorSharpFang: But in that case you would hedge against the risk and make profit by taking commission for transactions.
15:12 <Cyan_Spark> (Happened over the course of 2 weeks or so)
15:12 <RazorSharpFang> Finwe, people have to pay me up front even if I never get called (or put) upon. I make money for this.
15:13 <Lumindia> shortselling?
15:14 <Starlight_Glimmer> ADragonDreaming: It's easy to say that, but if we got stuck at our current economical output technological progress alone would drive up unemployment to level where it would be a threat to our society.
15:14 <Starlight_Glimmer> ADragonDreaming: I do fully agree with you though that especially when individual comapnies are concerned I value stability over growth.
15:14 <RazorSharpFang> Lumindia, I do not short-sell. I don't like the unlimited risk of that position.
15:14 <Finwe> Basically if someone wants to take a certain position you sell it to them, take the opposite position on the market and take a fee for the arrangement.
15:14 <Lumindia> what's shortselling, though?
15:14 <ADragonDreaming> Starlight_Glimmer: I'm talking about mergers like T-Mobile buying Sprint.
15:14 <Finwe> That's what banks do.
15:15 <RazorSharpFang> To short-sell: To sell what you do not own, to buy it later and pray that it's cheaper then.
15:15 <ADragonDreaming> Or the AT&T and Time Warner merger.
15:15 <Lumindia> ah
15:15 <Starlight_Glimmer> ADragonDreaming: Yeah I wondered why that was even allowed. The mobile carrier market isn't very divers.
15:15 <ADragonDreaming> Regulatory capture.
15:15 <ADragonDreaming> But it was attempted by the "Growth for Growth's sake" mentality
15:16 <ADragonDreaming> the one company has to become bigger and bigger because growth is always good. EVen if it saddles said company with massive debt (AT&T) and kills competition in the market.
15:16 <Starlight_Glimmer> In reality though mergers aren't usually designed to generate growth. Instead you either buy talent, customers, technology, or most often just use economy of scale effects to reduce cost.
15:17 <Starlight_Glimmer> The later of course results in profit growth, but is also required to keep companies competitive.
15:17 <ADragonDreaming> And lay off thousands of people in the process.
15:17 <ADragonDreaming> Despite promising not to.
15:17 <Cyan_Spark> Markets are too green across the board for me today. Guess I'll stay cash gang for a while longer yet.
15:18 <Cyan_Spark> Or maybe place a shameless lowball order and go to bed
15:18 <RazorSharpFang> AT&T is down -0.23%
15:18 <RazorSharpFang> On-topic
15:18 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Silver Quill: After the Fact: MLP #93 [ https://tinyurl.com/y6htqu2m ]
15:18 <ADragonDreaming> They miss the Ma Bell days.
15:19 <Starlight_Glimmer> Well I'm obviously not a fan of their either, but take the coal industry in Germany for example. It's just not profitable, unsustainable and causes irreparable harm to the environment. Cutting these jobs, as difficult as that was/is, was the right choice.
15:19 * ADragonDreaming holds up an "Anti-trust Telecom"
15:19 <ADragonDreaming> That's comparing apples to teakettles, Starlight_Glimmer.
15:20 <RazorSharpFang> Isn't Germany still running coal power?
15:20 <ADragonDreaming> Pretty sure the US is, too.
15:21 <RazorSharpFang> I will forever advocate for Nuclear over Coal.
15:21 <Starlight_Glimmer> No. I'm just providing an example that this is sometimes the right thing to do. I don't know enough about U.S. Telecom companies to make a judgement on their cost structure, but considering they were titans not so long ago they probably have a huge overhead.
15:21 <ADragonDreaming> Starlight_Glimmer: going in the mergers in question, Telecom execs touted how the mergers would create jobs.
15:22 <ADragonDreaming> Then turned out and eliminated positions instead, as everyone with half a brain could tell would happen.
15:22 <ADragonDreaming> They get no passes.
15:22 <ADragonDreaming> There is nothing justifiable about it. At all.
15:22 <Schism> I'm reminded that the UK is still looking to continue on with a gigantic coal mine.
15:22 <RazorSharpFang> Unless they're going to guarantee not cutting losses via a contract, it's cheap talk and I would put no weight in it. Same as all PR messages.
15:23 <ADragonDreaming> The contracts don't matter. They've broken terms of mergers before.
15:23 <Starlight_Glimmer> RazorSharpFang: https://www.bmwi.de/Redaktion/EN/Dossier/electricity-market-of-the-future.html
15:23 <Starlight_Glimmer> The numbers are a bit outdated, but it will give you an idea and I needed an English source.
15:23 <ADragonDreaming> (side note, my brother-in-law is a Professor of chemical engineering at McMasters and is at the forefront of developing methods of ensuring fossil fuels remain clean)
15:24 <Starlight_Glimmer> Coal is still a thing here, but deep mining (correct me on the term here) is basically no longer a thing.
15:24 <ADragonDreaming> (Clean coal is actually a possibility, and cleaner fossil fuel processes are, at least according to him, the main feasible method to get society through to the point of being fully green)
15:24 <Starlight_Glimmer> Surface mining is coming to an end shortly)
15:24 <LibrarianofHope> weaning out of fossil fuels seems like the sensible option
15:25 <RazorSharpFang> Does that include drill-and-blast operations?
15:25 <ADragonDreaming> Yes. Weaning, is the key.
15:25 <ADragonDreaming> Especially since green energy production methods are not where they need to be, yet.
15:25 <LibrarianofHope> on a society point i would gradual normalizing of green methods will yieldmore effient results
15:25 <ADragonDreaming> And in the meantime, said fossil fuel energy production can be made a hell of a lot more environmentally friendly.
15:26 <Starlight_Glimmer> ADragonDreaming: Yeah the reason is BS. You can do nice "accounting" tricks as far as job creation is concerned (e.g. only looking at specific business branches), but overall mergers don't really create jobs, the opposite really.
15:27 <Starlight_Glimmer> RazorSharpFang: Short term I get why people think nuclear power is attractive, but if you include the cost of dealing with nuclear waste and all the risks associated with that I don't think it's worth it.
15:27 <Starlight_Glimmer> We literally need to keep that away from any living thing for thousands of years.
15:28 <RazorSharpFang> I think it's preferrable to coal.
15:28 <ADragonDreaming> I hear they've made good progress on Fusion.
15:28 <Starlight_Glimmer> We have ways to deal with CO_2, I have not yet seen any reasonable way to deal with nuclear waste.
15:28 <ADragonDreaming> And I guess India is doing interesting things with Thorium?
15:29 <RazorSharpFang> I'm a bit advocate of Thorium for nuclear power.
15:29 <Starlight_Glimmer> ADragonDreaming: They make "good progress" since decades. It's probably not happening any time soon and if that viable I'll happily advocate for it.
15:29 <ADragonDreaming> Oh, aye, I'm not holding a torch.
15:29 <ADragonDreaming> It was just interesting to hear that progress was made.
15:30 <ADragonDreaming> (I would like a Mr. Fusion, but who wouldn't?)
15:30 <Starlight_Glimmer> I sometimes fear that this will lead to people thinking the problems we have right now will just be solved by technology in a couple of years and we need not worry.
15:31 <ADragonDreaming> Aye. Thus why I like that people like my brother-in-law exist
15:32 <Starlight_Glimmer> It might be! It would be cool if that happens, but in the here and now I'd prefer working on solutions that actually exist. Even if nuclear fusion happens a wind farm is still useful, might just be not profitable.
15:32 <ADragonDreaming> energy production feels like one of those things that shouldn't be for profit in the first place.
15:32 <ADragonDreaming> like healthcare.
15:32 <ADragonDreaming> or education.
15:33 <ADragonDreaming> self-sustaining non-profit
15:33 <ADragonDreaming> but not "for profit"
15:33 <Starlight_Glimmer> That being said: My country's politician and specifically Angela Merkel did a particularly bad job communicating and executing the move away from nuclear power.
15:34 <Starlight_Glimmer> Well market forces do actually help make things cheap and reliable.
15:34 <ADragonDreaming> Sometimes.
15:34 <Starlight_Glimmer> Publicly funded operations have quite often little incentive to improve and innovate.
15:34 <ADragonDreaming> Other times they lead to the idiocy that is the power company in California.
15:34 <ADragonDreaming> PG&E
15:34 <RazorSharpFang> You mean the one that's the only power company because of state legislature?
15:35 <ADragonDreaming> And is somehow a for profit company.
15:35 <RazorSharpFang> Not fair to call that a market if there's no other participants.
15:35 <ADragonDreaming> Sure.
15:35 <Starlight_Glimmer> That's why I strongly advocate for what essentially is a baseline publicly run operation and private actors are free to offer better products.
15:35 <ADragonDreaming> Yes, that works.
15:35 <RazorSharpFang> Starlight_Glimmer, sure. I can 100% get behind the government acting as a market actor. That's 100% cool.
15:36 <RazorSharpFang> I have problems when the government legislates and causes market inefficiencies.
15:36 <ADragonDreaming> The issue is that I don't trust "market forces" to not turn into "we're cutting corners that shouldn't be cut to save on costs"
15:36 <Starlight_Glimmer> Also infrastructure should never be permanently owned by private organizations. The lines get blurry on this fast, but at least they should be required to offer access to competitors at reasonable prices.
15:37 <ADragonDreaming> and, yes, the realities of infrastructure installation lead to regional monopolies
15:37 <RazorSharpFang> Infrastructure I can see being publicly owned, as there's almost always just 1 of them. Auto-monopoly, bad.
15:37 <ADragonDreaming> such as we see with US telecom companies.
15:38 <RazorSharpFang> If I were in charge they'd've been broken up years if not decades ago.
15:38 <RazorSharpFang> Of course, I'm the sort of person who'd break up Apple and Google in a heartbeat.
15:39 *** Quits: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net) (Connection closed)
15:39 <Starlight_Glimmer> I don't like the idea of breaking up companies unless there is an actual abuse of power.
15:40 <Starlight_Glimmer> You can see with the U.S. telecom companies that this strategy was particularly effective in the past.
15:40 <RazorSharpFang> I think we have evidence of that in Google and Apple myself
15:40 <Starlight_Glimmer> And as much as I dislike Apples closed ecosystem I don't see too much abuse on their end,
15:41 <RazorSharpFang> I think the fact that they've threatened to take down apps unless they make changes (*cough Tumblr cough*) is enough.
15:41 <Starlight_Glimmer> I would certainly prefer if they'd be required to open up their software for 3rd parties, but I can also see why this isn't happening just yet.
15:42 <Starlight_Glimmer> I'm not convinced Apple is to blame there alone.
15:42 <ADragonDreaming> The issue with "breaking up apple" or "breaking up google" is... break them up into what?
15:43 <Starlight_Glimmer> Smaller companies
15:43 <ADragonDreaming> That doesn't answer the question adequately.
15:43 <Starlight_Glimmer> E.g. separate ad and search business.
15:43 <RazorSharpFang> A set of smaller companies with more cohesive models.
15:43 <ADragonDreaming> Can you make money on search alone?
15:43 <Starlight_Glimmer> Kinda, but they're not supposed to.
15:44 <Starlight_Glimmer> The idea is that they'd have to shop around for ads too
15:44 <ADragonDreaming> So then how does the search-only company post-break survive?
15:44 <Starlight_Glimmer> So other companies would have a chance to do their ads on Google search.
15:44 <ADragonDreaming> So they still serve ads?
15:45 <Starlight_Glimmer> Essentially you'd sell ad space on Google search, but this would be separate from their division that buys and sells ads.
15:46 <Starlight_Glimmer> This would in theory at least allow more competition.
15:46 <Starlight_Glimmer> Since if you want ads on the internet at the moment you have to interact with Google.
15:46 <Starlight_Glimmer> There's very little viable competition.
15:47 <ADragonDreaming> So you want to specifically bust up Google's massive ad presence.
15:47 *** Joins: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net)
15:48 <Starlight_Glimmer> Tumblr probably had issues on their business end as well. Adult content and ads don't go well together. This is at least partially to blame on U.S. culture and prudeness.
15:48 <ADragonDreaming> They did fine until they were acquired.
15:48 <ADragonDreaming> By... Verizon?
15:48 <ADragonDreaming> I think?
15:49 <ADragonDreaming> Whoever made the decision to change policies, which then led to a mass exodus from Tumblr, and then that company decided to sell it again
15:49 <Starlight_Glimmer> ADragonDreaming: The idea is to just separate the individuals business units, so Google is no longer a one stop shop for everything.
15:49 <ADragonDreaming> that whole process just seemed to indicate that verizon didn't know what they were doing.
15:50 <Starlight_Glimmer> If you have an Android phone at the moment, you probably also using GMail and YouTube.
15:50 <ADragonDreaming> Point of order: I was using those prior to having an android phone.
15:50 <ADragonDreaming> Mostly on the merits of those services themselves, rather than the phone integration.
15:50 <Starlight_Glimmer> If those units had to compete for pre-installation space other companies for example there would be more competition.
15:51 <Starlight_Glimmer> Sure. But what it does is that Google sucks you into their ecosystem and since individual units don't need to turn a profit they have an unfair advantage.
15:51 <ADragonDreaming> I'd be more in favor of forcing the allowance of other app stores on the phones.
15:52 <Starlight_Glimmer> YT wouldn't be as big as it is, if they had to pay bills from day one.
15:52 <Starlight_Glimmer> Mind you of course YT used to be independent.
15:52 <ADragonDreaming> YT was big before smart phones, though
15:52 <ADragonDreaming> I'm not sure that's the argument you want to make
15:52 <Starlight_Glimmer> That's irrelevant.
15:53 <ADragonDreaming> I'm not saying I don't agree with you, I'm pointing out that that specific point is not the one to make in this situation, since it doesn't hold up under scrutiny.
15:53 <ADragonDreaming> You'd want to use a different example.
15:53 <Starlight_Glimmer> Google heavily funded YT through other services to the point where the service was so attractive, that other platforms couldn't compete, because they didn't have a money printer in the basement
15:53 <ADragonDreaming> Oh, so you took a tangent from the smart-phone integration, I see
15:53 <Starlight_Glimmer> Companies have tried and failed to compete with YT.
15:54 <ADragonDreaming> That wasn't explained.
15:54 <Starlight_Glimmer> Yeah, sorry.
15:55 <Starlight_Glimmer> What has happened is that now YT is so big, that starting a competitor is basically impossible if you aim for the same market segment (home made videos).
15:55 <ADragonDreaming> The issue I have with most efforts to Break up Google is that they are A) half-hearted, and B) have so far been approached in a fashion that won't actually do it.
15:55 <ADragonDreaming> And will instead only create barriers to market entry
15:55 <ADragonDreaming> plus, I'm less concerned about Google right now than I am about telecom.
15:55 <Starlight_Glimmer> Now YT has a monopoly. What I will give Google is that they're generally quite good about not abusing their power too much.
15:55 <Starlight_Glimmer> This again is why I'm not in favor of breaking them up.
15:56 <ADragonDreaming> Which is why they're less a concern for me than Comcast, AT&T, Verizon, and Spectrum.
15:56 <ADragonDreaming> Who are why Net Neutrality rules went away.
15:57 <ADragonDreaming> But, with the results of Georgia, I have hopes of the FCC not being a hung jury
15:57 <ADragonDreaming> and the potential of some actual "doing the job" from that organization.
15:57 <Starlight_Glimmer> But occasionally the tech giants do abuse their power. Amazon used competitors business secrets they required them to submit in order to sell on Amazon to go to the manufacturers directly and cut the middle men out.
15:57 <ADragonDreaming> Yes, Amazon is a company that needs some swords stabbed into it.
15:57 <Starlight_Glimmer> Google unfairly promoted their own services like GMail in search results.
15:59 <Starlight_Glimmer> Just two examples. Apple has been guilty of strong arming smaller developers to comply with their ideas or get thrown out of the app store. For example they required that certain free apps offer premium in-app purchases.
15:59 <Starlight_Glimmer> I can't tell you where the red line should be, but there certainly is one.
15:59 <ADragonDreaming> Plus, Apple keeps opposing right-to-repair legislation
16:00 <ADragonDreaming> I'm not sure that Anti-trust is necessarily the right tool to deal with Apple and Google, myself, but...
16:00 <ADragonDreaming> I'm kind of with cory Doctorow: legitimize adversarial interoperability.
16:01 <ADragonDreaming> Which is where third-parties can do the work to make tools that can communicate with other systems, without needing input, permission, or help from the people that develop those other systems.
16:01 <Starlight_Glimmer> Most of the accusations thrown around a nonsense though. Like when people claim they're censored on YT etc. etc. They don't actually do something anti-competitive there. I do believe they have a right to curate content for example and most of the time people actually mean demonetization. Controversial content just is a threat for Googles business.
16:02 <ADragonDreaming> So, for example, you could have some kind of Social Media system that can pull your friends list from Facebook and can allow you to communicate with Facebook friends
16:02 <ADragonDreaming> without needing Facebook to do anything.
16:02 <ADragonDreaming> Or you could have an app that, with your permission, but not necessarily Google's, allows you offline access to your Gmail content.
16:03 <ADragonDreaming> etc.
16:03 <ADragonDreaming> or, wonder of wonders, syncing your gmail inbox and your yahoo inbox...
16:04 <Starlight_Glimmer> Right to repair is one of the difficult topics. I agree people should be able to run their own software on devices and I do believe Apple should not be able to use trademarks to prevent the import of replacement and refurbished parts, nor should they be allowed to pair components tightly together without offering any way to reset that even if that means data loss.
16:04 <Starlight_Glimmer> I do however think it's a bit silly to expect Apple to provide replacement parts and all their internal tools.
16:06 <ADragonDreaming> Mostly I just want them to stop going after third-party repair shops.
16:06 <Starlight_Glimmer> Make no mistake: Repairing IPhones does cut into their profits even if we believe that's worth it I don't think we should be able to require them to work against their own interests do directly.
16:06 <ADragonDreaming> Also the right-to-repair movement started with farmers who were mad at John Deere.
16:06 <Starlight_Glimmer> Yeah that's a sad story :(
16:07 <Starlight_Glimmer> See I keep warning about cloud connected nonsense and DRM and I keep getting ignored.
16:07 <ADragonDreaming> DRM should be illegal.
16:08 <RazorSharpFang> I think a license key to install is fine myself.
16:08 <Starlight_Glimmer> See again difficult topic. I do believe there is some value in protecting intellectual property. I that wasn't the case large productions just could not happen,
16:09 <ADragonDreaming> DRM is malware.
16:09 <Starlight_Glimmer> I just don't believe DRM should be protected by law.
16:09 <ADragonDreaming> It's an unwanted program that invades my privacy.
16:10 <Starlight_Glimmer> Circumventing DRM for personal use, archival, education or accessibility should not be illegal.
16:10 <Cepheid> Personally I'd prefer a malware that prevents hackers from, well, hacking online games. But only if it's done in a secure manner, and not circumventing OS features.
16:10 <ADragonDreaming> It does nothing to protect sales, and whenever DRM is involved, pirates are, as ever, unaffected.
16:10 <Starlight_Glimmer> It's not that simple.
16:10 <ADragonDreaming> It literally only makes the experience worse for paying customers.
16:10 <Cepheid> As it is..
16:11 <ADragonDreaming> No, it really is that simple.
16:11 <Cepheid> DRM right now is not a preventative measure that works.
16:11 <Starlight_Glimmer> To believe that if no protection was given simply everybody would still make a purchase is a bit ignorant.
16:11 <Cepheid> But what it does do, is slow down piracy such that sales get a boost.
16:11 <ADragonDreaming> It's ineffective, anti-consumer, and invasive.
16:11 <Starlight_Glimmer> Certainly piracy and theft are different things.
16:11 <Cepheid> That said.
16:11 <Starlight_Glimmer> It doesn't have to be.
16:11 <ADragonDreaming> Dude, I still buy games.
16:11 <Cepheid> It's broken by default.
16:12 <ADragonDreaming> I don't buy them because I can't pirate them
16:12 <Cepheid> Because the companies that would WANT DRM in order to increase sales, are often the ones who can't afford to implement it.
16:12 <Starlight_Glimmer> DRM can be as simple as a check that makes sure a license key uses the correct format and in multiplayer two participants can't use the same key.
16:12 <Starlight_Glimmer> That's already DRM.
16:12 <Cepheid> Indies gain to benefit from DRM-boosted sales. Big companies like Ubi, EA, and the like, do not.
16:12 <Starlight_Glimmer> Steam is DRM.
16:12 <ADragonDreaming> The idea that DRM is necessary to drive sales doesn't hold up.
16:12 <Cepheid> It does when piracy cuts into the bottom line big time.
16:13 <Starlight_Glimmer> I'm mostly fine with Steam, because it offers convenience. There's a benefit to the system.
16:13 <Cepheid> Which, for an indie, is a bigger issue than again, the likes of Ubi, EA and such.
16:13 <ADragonDreaming> I welcome examples of piracy cutting into the bottom line.
16:13 <ADragonDreaming> Like, actually proved to have done so.
16:13 <ADragonDreaming> Not merely claimed
16:13 <Cepheid> Very well, you win this argument, as I have nothing to back my claims.
16:13 <Starlight_Glimmer> It's actually quite simple: If DRM didn't cut into sales companies wouldn't spend millions developing it.
16:13 <Cepheid> I don't agree with DRM, but I am trying to put the concept into perspective. Again though, as stated, it's broken with the current system.
16:13 <ADragonDreaming> The issue is that I haven't seen said examples from anyone
16:14 <Cepheid> It benefits the big guys, not the ones who actually need it.
16:14 <ADragonDreaming> There's plenty of cases of it being claimed
16:14 <ADragonDreaming> but there's no data that backs up piracy as being the actual cause
16:14 <ADragonDreaming> There's a key fallacy in the assumption that a pirated game is a lost sale.
16:14 <Starlight_Glimmer> DRM doesn't have to be cracker proof. It has has to make copying inconvenient.
16:14 <Cepheid> I have seen people contact indies to say that they pirated the game initially because of concerns, but then bought the game at a later date.
16:15 <ADragonDreaming> When in fact there's a high chance that the person who pirated the game would not have bought it at all
16:15 <Cepheid> Concerns which I admit, could be resolved through a rise in the shareware or demo scene again.
16:15 <ADragonDreaming> And then, yes, you have plenty of examples of those cases, where people pirate to try it out
16:15 <Cepheid> In fact, I plan to use that approach.
16:15 <ADragonDreaming> to make sure it's worth the purchase
16:15 <ADragonDreaming> and then they buy it.
16:15 <Cepheid> In any case, if I want DRM, I'd do it in a different way.
16:15 <Starlight_Glimmer> I don't claim that ADragonDreaming, the opposite, but without any DRM large scale productions would probably not work.
16:15 <Cepheid> In a manner not unlike Factorio's approach.
16:16 <Cepheid> The game's fully functional whether you have an account or not, or obtained it legally or not.
16:16 <ADragonDreaming> I disagree, Starlight_Glimmer.
16:16 <Cepheid> You just can't host public servers, or join certain servers.
16:16 <Cepheid> The servers can be configured to accept only legitimate users.
16:16 <Cepheid> That is, people who have an account with Wube's website, and a purchased copy of Factorio on the account.
16:16 <Cepheid> But you can disable that functionality.
16:17 <Starlight_Glimmer> Easy example: I have a Netflix subscription. The inconvenience of DRM and streaming illegal copies probably drove part of my purchasing decision.
16:17 <Cepheid> So that anyone, even pirated copies, can join.
16:17 <Starlight_Glimmer> Also yes Netflix of courses uses DRM.
16:17 <Cepheid> Hum. My temperament is not under complete control. I'm able to keep it from going too far, but these discussions that can get heated still bug me.
16:17 <Cepheid> A lot.
16:17 <Starlight_Glimmer> Without DRM a subscription based streaming model wouldn't make much sense to begin with.
16:17 <RazorSharpFang> Time for me to sleep, cy'all
16:18 <Starlight_Glimmer> I'd sub for a month, download all the titles and unsub until something new comes out.
16:18 <AppleDash> Downloading DRM-free copies just works better for me, especially given I don't necessarily want to be running the proprietary DRM software. It also just straight up crashes on my machine.
16:18 <Starlight_Glimmer> And if you don't believe that's would people would do I must appeal to your common sense.
16:19 <Starlight_Glimmer> AppleDash: You're not wrong. Still even though I don't like DRM I prefer buying games on Steam over e.g. GOG.
16:19 <ADragonDreaming> I think we might have different meanings of DRM.
16:19 <ADragonDreaming> The way I'm using it, I don't consider "netflix" to be implementing it, since in that case there is zero installtion of something on my computer.
16:20 <Cepheid> In any case I'm going back to Factorio in the meantime.
16:20 <Starlight_Glimmer> Oh there is ADragonDreaming
16:20 <Cepheid> Actually, technically there is.
16:20 <Starlight_Glimmer> You just don't realize it!
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16:20 <Cepheid> You need a Firefox or Chromium addon to play DRM content in a browser.
16:20 <Cepheid> It's usually installed automatically as part of the browser, or during playback.
16:20 <Cepheid> Firefox's a bit more apparent about it, as it asks if you want to install it, at least under Linux.
16:20 <ADragonDreaming> Then that needs to go away.
16:21 <Cepheid> You can at least turn off the addon after you're done.
16:21 <Starlight_Glimmer> And yes, that thing is talking to licensing servers!
16:21 <Starlight_Glimmer> And it's the reason you can't just save an episode of your favorite Netflix show,
16:21 <ADragonDreaming> Or at the very least, tell me its happening.
16:22 <Starlight_Glimmer> Youtube uses DRM as well!
16:22 <Cepheid> And yes, there is some confusion about the meaning of DRM. Because for example, Wube's setup for Factorio is considered DRM. But then, you got more invasive techniques also labeled DRM.
16:22 <Starlight_Glimmer> Not on all videos mind you
16:22 <Starlight_Glimmer> (I don't consider their URI obfuscation DRM)
16:23 <Starlight_Glimmer> You couldn't use Netflix on Linux for some time, simply because your browser stated it was running on Linux.
16:23 <Cepheid> This is actually a thing yes. And meanwhile, Amazon Prime Video runs at SD resolution on Linux.
16:24 <ADragonDreaming> I'm still on the side of "outlaw it"
16:24 <Cepheid> Oh, I don't disagree.
16:24 <Starlight_Glimmer> Of course circumventing that - which could be argued was illegal - was trivial.
16:24 <ADragonDreaming> and then allow for some restrictions, on a strictly non-invasive basis.
16:24 <ADragonDreaming> I'm also on the side of "copying is not theft"
16:24 <Cepheid> I wish we could go back to the days of enforcing physical copies instead of using digital distribution. Digital distribution is entirely the reason that DRM became so prevalent.
16:25 <Starlight_Glimmer> See ADragonDreaming that's the difficult thing with DRM: Most people don't really notice it.
16:25 <Starlight_Glimmer> PC gaming is one of those rare exceptions.
16:25 <ADragonDreaming> Cepheid: do you remember the Sony Rootkit fiasco?
16:25 <Cepheid> I won't lie. DRM won't go away even if we go back to physical copies.
16:25 <Cepheid> But it sure would help.
16:26 <ADragonDreaming> It happened back when physical CDs were the primary method of music distribution
16:26 <Cepheid> But there's a cost associated with physical copies.
16:26 <Starlight_Glimmer> If I'd ask someone why they can't read their Kindle ebook on INSERT_RANDOM_DEVICE_HERE they'd probably say it just "doesn't support that format" or something similar.
16:26 <Cepheid> Namely, the plastics, the metal, and so on.
16:26 <Starlight_Glimmer> The only reason of course is DRM.
16:26 <ADragonDreaming> mostly, I'd say that "DRM became prevalent b/c of digital distribution" isn't quite accurate
16:26 <Cepheid> Okay, fine.
16:26 <Cepheid> It grew due to it, rather.
16:27 <Starlight_Glimmer> Video tapes had "DRM" too, just without the digital part.
16:27 <ADragonDreaming> It became prevalent because the music and movie industry couldn't handle the idea of not being in complete control of everything.
16:27 <Cepheid> In any case, mother's offering to help me set up new TV, so I'm gonna go get that all set up.
16:27 <Starlight_Glimmer> Copy protection is as old as media.
16:28 <Starlight_Glimmer> I have literally documents lying around printed black on red because copy machines couldn't handle that well.
16:29 <Starlight_Glimmer> The mechanisms or fundamentals employed by DRM predate digital music.
16:29 <ADragonDreaming> I think I'm not in favor of a return to a physical distribution standard, for an odd reason.
16:29 <ADragonDreaming> Or, well, perhaps not odd. Just not obvious.
16:30 <ADragonDreaming> Specifically: Environmental effects.
16:30 <ADragonDreaming> physical media distribution leads to a lot of material waste. Old CDs, packaging of said CDs, etc. etc.
16:30 <Starlight_Glimmer> A great example of that is the publishing of scientific works. They fought for their publishing rights for ages.
16:30 <ADragonDreaming> Digital Distribution eliminates that material waste
16:30 <Starlight_Glimmer> Mind you mostly concerning works that were publicly funded to begin with.
16:31 <ADragonDreaming> Secondly, physical distribution requires, you know. Vehicles to distribute it.
16:31 <ADragonDreaming> Which given climate change, that's a concern.
16:31 <ADragonDreaming> ...Pirate your games! It's good for the environment! :D
16:31 <ADragonDreaming> (I jest)
16:32 <Starlight_Glimmer> I still have issues playing some DVDs on Linux due to DRM and I don't believe there's any legal way to play encrypted Blu-Rays (most commercially released are encrypted)
16:33 <ADragonDreaming> sounds like legimitized adversarial interoperability would help with that.
16:33 <Starlight_Glimmer> DVD playback is only legal because it was ruled CSS encryption used on DVDs is ineffective and therefor you're allowed to circumvent it.
16:33 <Starlight_Glimmer> (on Linux)
16:34 <Starlight_Glimmer> Well I guess like VLC on Windows does the same
16:34 <Starlight_Glimmer> And if you ever had to use e.g. PowerDVD you'll know what pain that piece of s... was.
16:35 <AppleDash> I am personally of the belief that if I have data in my posession I should be allowed to do as I wish with it; some uses of it might be immoral (eg: sharing secret information that somebody disclosed to me), but that's up to me, not the law
16:38 <Starlight_Glimmer> I do believe certain limits are helpful. For example I'd not want to pay for the license to stream the music to all the world if I only want to listen to an album.
16:38 <Starlight_Glimmer> Nor do I believe purchasing a DVD makes me entitled to run Netflix.
16:40 <Starlight_Glimmer> It's just a giant pain. We do need to relax restrictions on individuals though.
16:41 <Starlight_Glimmer> Also exceptions for stuff that isn't commercially available anymore.
16:41 <ADragonDreaming> Reduce copyright terms.
16:42 <ADragonDreaming> Eliminate DMCA anti-circumention measures and reform the current abusable liability measures.
16:43 * Starlight_Glimmer snuggles into AppleDash.
16:43 <Starlight_Glimmer> Enough copyright rant for today!
16:52 * AppleDash pets Starlight_Glimmer
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17:04 <Schism> WHAT... is your name? WHAT... is your favourite colour?! WHAT... is the fourth word in the fifth paragraph on page 67 of the manual?!
17:05 <LibrarianofHope> the fourth word is wut
17:05 <LibrarianofHope> my favorite color is octarine
17:05 <Schism> A fine colour.
17:06 <LibrarianofHope> my name is librarian, says on the tag
17:06 * Schism passes the Librarian a banana.
17:06 <LibrarianofHope> ok
17:06 <LibrarianofHope> i mean ook
17:06 <Schism> No, it's-- yes.
17:08 <Starlight_Glimmer> Odd. My name tag says "Hello my name is foo'); DROP TABLE users;--"
17:09 <Schism> Ah yes, little Bobby Tables, we call him.
17:11 <Cepheid> Gods damned it.
17:12 <Cepheid> I got the TV set up, and went to remove the protective pieces on it.
17:12 <Cepheid> And the tape was attached SO HARD that it damaged the TV to remove them.
17:12 <Schism> what... >_O
17:12 <Cepheid> Yeah, I got a number of dead pixels because of it.
17:12 <Cepheid> A large number.
17:12 <Schism> Is the TV under warranty?
17:13 <Cepheid> I'm taking it back to Best Buy, and we'll get it replaced.
17:16 * Schism nods. "Blergh."
17:16 * Starlight_Glimmer hoofs Schism a can of sugar free nonsparkling iced tea.
17:17 * Schism adds lemon, and sips. Offers Starlight_Glimmer a cup of masala chai with extra cream and sugar.
17:20 <LibrarianofHope> i ended uo becoming something like a manager
17:20 <LibrarianofHope> its not that hard in my context
17:21 <LibrarianofHope> except i have to work with a 39 years old permanent party frat boy type
17:21 * LibrarianofHope bonks schism for moral support
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17:24 * Schism hugs the LibrarianofHope. "Yeesh."
17:24 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> its so bad i got altered
17:24 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> badumtss
17:28 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Metal Music: Fight This War 2021 [ https://tinyurl.com/y5zuwsyz ]
17:28 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Calpain: Fanfiction: The Moon Has Two Faces [ https://tinyurl.com/yydovjvd ]
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17:36 <Cepheid> The discolored pixels fixed themselves over time. That said, there are legitimate, permanently dead pixels.
17:39 * Schism nods. :<
17:40 <Cepheid> The warranty doesn't disclude dead pixels, at least.
17:42 <Schism> "Is that guy betraying you and making an attempt on your life without any weapons or plans whatsoever?" "Yeah." "That's adorable." "STOP IGNORING ME!"
17:59 <Cepheid> Best Buy is making it very hard to get into contact with anyone at all.
18:07 * Schism grumbles, and passes Cepheid a salted caramel bar with peanuts and pretzels. "Now to wait for my doctor to call... sometime."
18:08 <Cepheid> It's not just individual pixels, either.
18:08 <Schism> Eugh.
18:08 <Cepheid> The upper one is a cluster of about 8 or 9 pixels.
18:08 <Cepheid> It's a large dot.
18:11 <Cepheid> That said, the TV itself is nice. Large, fits on my desk just fine, and has an audio out port, so I can hook up my good speakers to it.
18:12 * Schism nodnods. "Just a matter of replacing it with one which doesn't have that dot."
18:13 <Cepheid> Mmhmm.
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18:28 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Drawfriend - Equestria Girls / Anthro MLP Art Gallery #260 [ https://tinyurl.com/y624n4xt ]
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18:39 <Cepheid> Alternative solution. Return it, "It's not what I thought I wanted." and then get myself something more desk-sized, because man this thing is absolutely ginormous.
18:45 <Schism> A possibility, certainly.
18:46 * Schism hums, and considers her options. "Kinda want pancakes and bacon."
18:51 <Cepheid> That said, finding another display is freakishly hard right now.
18:51 <Cepheid> Thanks to certain consoles being released.
18:59 <Cepheid> ... Hum, here's an idea. Return the display, get refund. Buy nice 20-30" monitor, and get myself a really good chair so that I can actually sit close to my desk again.
19:03 <Cepheid> Though damn do I really like this.
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19:11 <ADragonDreaming> That dealership needs to get someone other than Cousin Jimmy to be their IT.
19:13 <ADragonDreaming> "Compressed (zipped) Folders Error" - Windows cannot complete the extraction. The destination file could not be created.
19:13 <ADragonDreaming> IT apparently looked at that said, shrugged, and said "Call RouteOne."
19:14 <ADragonDreaming> Said file downloads, uncompresses, and the driver contained within installs without issue on every other computer tested.
19:17 <Schism> First doctor's appointment, complete. I mean... it was just an overview of the situation, and I've another next week to go into more issues.
19:40 <Schism> Hah. Shopify no longer wants anything to do with Mr. Orange. Horse, barn door, etc.
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19:43 <ADragonDreaming> Shopify... was selling Trump apparel and such?
19:44 <LibrarianofHope> amazon is selling normally
19:44 <LibrarianofHope> trump stuff
19:45 <LibrarianofHope> we are living in intersting times
19:45 <LibrarianofHope> i didnt want that owo
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19:52 <Schism> Adra: Yeah. https://techcrunch.com/2021/01/07/shopify-pulls-donald-trump-stores-off-its-website/
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19:59 <Schism> *derp*
19:59 <DerpyBot> *derp*
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20:04 <Schism> Some mornings I feel this way. http://www.twindragonscomic.com/comic/breakfast-of-champions/
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20:29 <Starlight_Glimmer> Can I just say that credit cards are increasingly confusing? I'm still amazed that this is the default payment option in the U.S. Direct debit and bank transfers are so much easier :P
20:30 <Starlight_Glimmer> Also screw them embossed characters. Nobody physically transfers them anymore. Just get rid of them.
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20:41 <ADragonDreaming> you realize that you can put in debit card info into a credit card form, right?
20:41 <ADragonDreaming> There are also some cases where credit card is safer than debit
20:42 <ADragonDreaming> debit/bank transfer, the money is transferred out. Credit card, there's a potential to do chargebacks in case of bad actor.
20:43 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> i have another so funny problem
20:43 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> ever had to deal with a "i know everything" guy at work?
20:44 <Starlight_Glimmer> In Germany no you can't. That being said we also call debit cards issued by Visa/MasterCard credit cards for reasons, because debit cards refer to our national system, which is different.
20:44 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> we are trying to teach a new employee, and i have to deal with the alcoholic manchild teaching her possibly weird crap
20:44 <Starlight_Glimmer> I can issue a charge back for direct debit as well. Not for bank transfers though, obviously.
20:46 * Dappled stares at his hard drives and loves the blue bars. No red bars for him.
20:46 <ADragonDreaming> Sure, but you were talking about "in the U.S."
20:48 <Starlight_Glimmer> Yes, but only for the default payment option part.
20:54 <ADragonDreaming> Right, and my answer spoke to some reasons why.
20:55 <ADragonDreaming> In the U.S. Specifically.
20:56 * Dappled looks at date. Two days till his favorite story updates.
20:56 * Dappled sits there, wagging his tail.
20:58 <Cepheid> Ah, Rise Demo is tomorrow ADragonDreaming.
20:58 <Starlight_Glimmer> Don't ever ask a random German about payment cards. The generally have no clue. As I said all cards issued by Visa or MasterCard are called credit cards around here for some reason. If you say debit cards people will think of giro cards, which are most often called ec (electronic cash) cards despite that system no longer being in use. Giro cards - which even fewer people are aware of -
20:58 <Starlight_Glimmer> also feature a payment processing component for transactions outside of Germany, V-Pay (Visa) or maestro (MasterCard). Within Germany a special giro card system is in use though. That's not all though: You can also transfer money on the card itself through a feature called Geldkarte ("money card"). It's supposed to be more like actual cash. I don't know a single person who has ever used
20:58 <Starlight_Glimmer> that.
20:59 * Ali crawls onto Dappled
20:59 * Dappled hugs the Ali. Shows her his Growlithe.
21:00 <Starlight_Glimmer> Also: Germans generally don't use credit cards the way they were intended, meaning they don't carry a balance. A lot of so called "credit cards" don't even offer that feature, so they're more like charge cards in the U.S.
21:00 <Starlight_Glimmer> It's all a giant mess.
21:00 <Ali> Yay messes
21:00 <Cepheid> ... The hell?
21:00 * Dappled has never had a credit card.
21:00 <Cepheid> ADra, apparently we can ride wyverns.
21:00 <Dappled> Debit for life.
21:00 <Cepheid> As in, fight using the monster.
21:01 <ADragonDreaming> Nice!
21:01 <Cepheid> It's an upgraded variation of clutch clawing too, looks like.
21:01 <Cepheid> So you can turn the monster and slam it into walls.
21:01 <Cepheid> https://twitter.com/monsterhunter/status/1347186702373199874
21:02 * Dappled throws a pokeball at Dodogama.
21:02 <Cepheid> Oooooh! Mizu is back!
21:02 <Starlight_Glimmer> Which brings me to the credit cards issue I had today: I was blissfully unaware how many different names there are for "security" codes printed on the card itself. I was under the impression only CV2 was relevant, I was wrong.
21:02 <Cepheid> Oh, for us, the demo is already available Adra.
21:03 <Cepheid> Says 8th on the tweet, but the end of the video says it should be available now.
21:03 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: "Evermore" A Celestia and Luna Song [ https://tinyurl.com/y4anle9j ]
21:03 <Starlight_Glimmer> See for the first time I'm in possession of a credit card that has more than one security code printed on it and the term used by the shop system was unfamiliar to me.
21:04 <Starlight_Glimmer> So down the rabbit hole I went :3
21:04 * LibrarianofHopeAlter puts a manhole on the rabbit hole
21:04 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> too many rabbit holes here
21:05 <Cepheid> Hum. Dun see it, so I'm assuming by 0:00 January 7th, they mean midnight tonight.
21:06 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> i got into the Hololive rabbit hole
21:06 * Dappled is angry at Hololive
21:06 <Schism> Hum. *messes about with Racemenu and other things on Skyrim* Chargen is fun when you unlock every option.
21:06 <Starlight_Glimmer> Dappled: Not advocating for carrying a balance and some people obviously can't handle money, but credit cards can be quite useful.
21:06 <Dappled> None of those people are Holo.
21:06 <Cepheid> Least with that, there are actual rabbits.
21:07 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> dappled you make the best puns
21:07 <Dappled> See, I carry the fear that any moment I will be struck by crippling medical debt, and if I don't have the money, I won't survive.
21:07 <Dappled> So my spending habits are fueled by fear
21:07 <Starlight_Glimmer> I order things from abroad quite often and I'd like to avoid paying a 2% foreign usage fee for example.
21:07 <Dappled> America.
21:08 <Starlight_Glimmer> Discipline is the key.
21:08 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> in normal times the mexican healt system is not that bad
21:08 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> right now we are basically broken, we need to make a holiday to doctors
21:09 <Starlight_Glimmer> Having an emergency fund for example does really improve your life.
21:09 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> yeah
21:09 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> i have lousy spending habits, but im aware of my very particular situation
21:09 <Starlight_Glimmer> I'm at the point where I might get in trouble for saving too much, my goals are a bit ambitious.
21:09 * Dappled 's emergency fund is eating ramen despite being able to afford to eat better.
21:10 * Dappled eats an entire sleeve of fig newtons.
21:10 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> seems harsh
21:10 <Dappled> Fear.
21:10 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> i wanna say try to eat better, but you knw your methods
21:10 <Schism> Dappled: Mmm. Fig newtons. Haven't had those in a while.
21:10 <Starlight_Glimmer> Well that won't give you a thousand bucks when your car/glasses/washing machine breaks.
21:11 * Dappled points out that he has thousands in the bank.
21:11 <Starlight_Glimmer> See, that's good ;)
21:11 * Dappled can afford a higher standard of living. Doesn't because of need to not spend the money.
21:11 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> you are like my brother owo
21:11 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> he has the same logic
21:12 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> its not a bad one really
21:12 <Starlight_Glimmer> I was going to say I can understand saving a sum like that up can be difficult with lower incomes, but it's definitely worth it.
21:12 <LibrarianofHopeAlter> i would be less harsh maybe personally, but you know your best paln
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21:15 <Starlight_Glimmer> My savings rate is like a little over 60%. Unemployment insurance, health insurance (expenses), government retirement plan (savings) not included.
21:16 <Starlight_Glimmer> (so essentially based on take home pay)
21:18 * Dappled chews on sticks for flavor.
21:19 <Lumindia_> 1 /me rolls in
21:20 <Starlight_Glimmer> Which brings me to: I hate people don't talk about money around here. It would greatly benefit many to have their financial situation checked by peers or lead them to a stronger position in salary negotiations. Consumer debt is a surprisingly common problem, though I believe not quite as bad as in the states (yet).
21:20 * LibrarianofHopeAlter rolls nat 20, Lumindia roll over the table edge
21:21 <Starlight_Glimmer> Probably because credit cards a are bit more uncommon and inaccessible around here -.-
21:23 * Dappled glares at electric type trainers. His 3 highest pokes are Wartortle, Pidgeotto, and Butterfree.
21:26 <Schism> I'm sure Butterfree won't fold like a cheap suit.
21:27 *** Joins: PinkieShy (coolm@Pony-ck81je.67-212-45-net.sccoast.net)
21:27 <Dappled> You say that, but Butterfee is the most deadly thing on my team.
21:27 <PinkieShy> hihi
21:27 * Dappled stares at the three pokemon it's crit tackled to death when I needed a capture.
21:27 <Schism> Oh, I know, one of the few mons you get with Psychic attacks, too.
21:28 <Dappled> Crit. Tackle.
21:28 <Dappled> It feeds on my pain.
21:28 * Dappled approriately named it Moonlight.
21:28 * Lumindia_ flumps upon Dappled
21:28 * Dappled brushies Lumindia_.
21:31 <Dappled> https://www.deviantart.com/vohvelintu/art/Dark-Souls-Moonlight-Butterfly-604748293 Cause I was like, yeah. That's Butterfree. And my Caterpie was like. "I shall surpass my namesake."
21:38 * Cepheid yawns, stretches.
21:44 <Cepheid> Hum. Looks like Rise has a lockon function.
21:44 <Dappled> MHW and Bloodborne has cured me of the need for lockon.
21:46 <Cepheid> Ow.
21:46 <Cepheid> I got my last mark.
21:46 * Dappled got so tired of the lockon messing up what I'm looking at. Cause walls.
21:46 <Cepheid> D+. Not surprised.
21:47 <Cepheid> But it's still a pass.
21:47 <Cepheid> So, I met my quota for OSAP and now they won't harangue me.
21:47 <ADragonDreaming> huzzah!
21:48 <ADragonDreaming> Dappled: I only need lock-on if there's not a good camera control.
21:48 <ADragonDreaming> I think in MH4U I took advantage of camera refocus more than lock on, but I'm not entirely remembering.
21:48 <Dappled> That's fair.
21:49 <ADragonDreaming> That said I was controlling camera via touch-screen controls since I was using a 2DS with just the one stick.
21:49 <ADragonDreaming> They were suprisingly responsive!
21:49 * Dappled doesn't believe this.
21:50 *** Joins: NitroTheFurry2 (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net)
21:52 *** Joins: Angeline (Scootaloo@I.Will.Fly.Higher)
21:52 *** Quits: NitroTheFurry2 (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net) (Connection closed)
21:52 *** Joins: NitroTheFurry2 (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net)
21:53 <Dappled> The worst part of playing FireRed? No chance to get a Vulpix. Just the worst.
21:54 <Schism> Indeed! Vulpix is best. :< At least you can get an Arcanine?
21:54 <Cepheid> ...
21:54 <Cepheid> My dad has a lead foot.
21:54 <Cepheid> He almost got a fine. 93 in a 70.
21:54 *** Quits: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-2un6s4.8sm8.pm8a.0380.2600.IP) (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
21:54 <Dappled> This is true. I do have Valmira the Growlithe. Just waiting to get more moves.
21:55 <Dappled> You should let him know that they make lighter prosethetics. Plastic is probably much cheaper too.
21:55 <ADragonDreaming> If I had the patience, I'd create Gym teams.
21:55 <ADragonDreaming> Teams of six based around a specific typing
21:56 *** NitroTheFurry2 is now known as NitroTheFurry
21:56 <Dappled> If I had the patience, I would redo all the spawns to incorporate all the pokes, spliting the day/night and different versions evenly.
22:00 * Dappled chews on things.
22:11 *** Quits: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net) (Connection closed)
22:11 * Dappled sees that Smite is adding Tiamat. That's not a 5 headed dragon? Why are they lying to me.
22:19 <Schism> "Right. Creamed peas on toast for you, creamed peas and tuna on toast for me." "Why no tuna in mine?" "Because canned tuna makes you break out in rage."
22:23 *** Joins: NitroTheFurry (Nitro@Pony-qk3k7e.open.airstreamcomm.net)
22:24 * Cepheid flops.
22:25 <Cepheid> !link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RazaCmEFMK8 ADragonDreaming
22:25 <DerpyBot> I need to ask Twilight about that one.
22:25 <DerpyBot> Twilight told me this video is about Monster Hunter Rise: Hunting 101 – Wyvern Riding
22:25 <Cepheid> So, basically, mounting's been replaced with Wyvern Riding.
22:26 <Schism> This was a really good meal... @_@ Which is good, because now I need to fast for 12 hours.
22:28 <Finwe> o3o
22:28 * Finwe noms on Ali's tail.
22:28 <Finwe> Good evening, everypony.
22:28 <Cepheid> Looks like Rise is about increasing mobility further.
22:29 <Schism> Better, I have some proto-gravy in the fridge which I can use on whatever else later. o3o
22:30 <Schism> (If need be I can add some onion soup mix into the package and turn it into a nice faux-fondue.)
22:30 <Cepheid> I swear Capcom intentionally pronounced "Tigrex" as "Teegrex" just to piss players off. Same with "Alatreon" as "Allah-trey-on".
22:32 <Cepheid> Ah, the demo is Great Izuchi and Mizutsune.
22:32 <Cepheid> With a general training quest, and a wyvern riding training quest.
22:33 <ADragonDreaming> Oh! Similar to the Generations demo.
22:33 <Cepheid> Locale is... Shrine Ruins.
22:33 <Dappled> Ooooh.
22:33 * Dappled can get another Rattata at Route 16.
22:34 <Cepheid> Another new locale...
22:34 <Dappled> Nope. Doduo.
22:34 <Cepheid> Frost Islands.
22:34 <Cepheid> Among the monsters revealed...
22:35 <Cepheid> Goss Harag, a fanged beast. Barioth. Khezu. Great Baggi. Mizu. Lagombi. Tigrex. And they also showed off Magnalamo in combat.
22:35 <Cepheid> !link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RazaCmEFMK8
22:35 <DerpyBot> Twilight told me this video is about Monster Hunter Rise: Hunting 101 – Wyvern Riding
22:35 <Cepheid> ...
22:36 <Cepheid> Wrong link.
22:36 <Cepheid> !link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUmcU4LT_jg
22:36 <DerpyBot> I need to ask Twilight about that one.
22:36 <DerpyBot> Twilight told me this video is about [OFFICIAL] Monster Hunter Digital Event – January 2021
22:36 * Schism grins at RLC once again. "Yeah, uh, like heck is Mae a C-cup at that stage."
22:37 <Cepheid> Heh.
22:41 * Finwe hats on Dappled.
22:41 * Dappled is stylish.
22:41 * Finwe is a posh top hat.
22:41 <Cepheid> Huzzah, my vision is swirling and warping. Not sure if that's a good or bad thing.
22:43 <Cepheid> Ali: Just a heads up, I made a cargo rocket. Also, there's a massive steam battery up in the north now. Don't touch it. It's to be used for emergencies only.
22:44 * Dappled just lost his pidgeotto. To a Celadon Gym Trainer no less. Stupid crits
22:45 * Schism pats. :<
22:46 * Angeline hides under Dappled and shakes.
22:46 * Cepheid buries it in a shallow grave, legs sticking out.
22:47 * Dappled brushies the Angeline.
22:47 * Angeline accepts brushies timidly.
22:49 * LibrarianofHopeAlter dances chunky
22:49 *** LibrarianofHopeAlter is now known as LibrarianofHope
22:57 <Dappled> So this is where I'm at in the Nuzlocke https://imgur.com/a/vQfbOx0 Going to go get ready for work. And be angry all night.
22:58 <Dappled> Stupid Exeggcute. Eating my Pidgeotto
22:58 <Cepheid> Can I request that the most obnoxious pokemon you capture be named after me?
23:01 <Cepheid> Alternatively, cutest pokemon you find should be named Ali.
23:05 * Dappled thinks this is good suggestions.
23:05 <Schism> Alievee.
23:06 * Dappled doesn't think he has good chances of getting an eevee.
23:14 <ADragonDreaming> don't you get given one in a city?
23:17 <Ali> Dappled, how silly you are
23:17 <Ali> If you're playing gen 1
23:17 <Ali> There's a gift vee
23:19 <LibrarianofHope> i never got mew from the stupid truck
23:19 <LibrarianofHope> i actually want an ancient mew card, out of stubbornes
23:23 * Ali owns an ancient mew card >.>
23:23 <DerpyBot> New post on Equestria Daily by Sethisto: Drawfriend Stuff (Pony Art Gallery) #3572 [ https://tinyurl.com/y3twlddl ]
23:29 *** Quits: Dakota (dwhitevalle@always.broken.sometimes.patched.never.fixed) (Quit: Rebooting...)
23:30 <LibrarianofHope> wanna trade?
23:30 <LibrarianofHope> i have an orange
23:31 *** Joins: Dakota (dwhitevalle@always.broken.sometimes.patched.never.fixed)
23:34 * Schism has a holo Ancient Mew as well.
23:34 <Schism> That was a fun movie.
23:34 <LibrarianofHope> owo
23:34 <LibrarianofHope> everyome got one
23:35 <LibrarianofHope> hence my residual frustation
23:35 <LibrarianofHope> !link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-Xxo6utgNA
23:35 <DerpyBot> I need to ask Twilight about that one.
23:35 <DerpyBot> Twilight told me this video is about Shirakami Fubuki - I am a cat
23:35 <LibrarianofHope> have a fox
23:37 <Schism> !link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvW4kQY2GQ8
23:37 <DerpyBot> I need to ask Twilight about that one.
23:37 <DerpyBot> Twilight told me this video is about [Hololive] Shirakami Fubuki I Am A Fox [English Sub]
23:39 <LibrarianofHope> i see you feel into that particular rabbit hole too
23:39 <Schism> Only a little bit.
23:40 <LibrarianofHope> come further
23:40 <LibrarianofHope> its fun
23:41 <LibrarianofHope> gaze at the void
23:55 *** Joins: Golden (uid250033@Pony-mioavt.c2vi.m095.067c.2001.IP)
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